Ammo for no electric cars

70bigblockdodge

Old Man with a Hat
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So here is a video I stumbled across that I think explains why electric cars are okay, but ICE cars will continue, marketing and $$$$ wise.

He has a bunch of other stuff on this and good layman's terms explanations
Bore vs stroke
Gas vs diesel
Turbo vs N/A
 
Jason does a pretty good job with his videos. They can be a little dry, but informative. I've linked that video somewhere here before. I always appreciate an objective look at things. The electric vehicle people can't stand to face some of the realities of all-electric vehicles, as pointed out in the video, not to mention how boring EVs are.

Here is an opinion piece posted on Hagerty a few days ago that I feel hits-the-nail-on-the-head concerning EVs and the governmental push/force.

What if you held a mandatory EV party and nobody came?
... The “leaders” in this case are all the government mandarins and mountebanks who have implemented drop-deadlines to abolish the “ICE” at some point in time that is always beyond the limits of their current term.

The automakers are actually egging the feds on here; two years ago, they met with President Trump and begged him to make sure the CAFE requirements kept climbing to the point where it would eventually be impossible to make gas-powered vehicles.

There’s a reason for that, and it’s simple: Electric Vehicles (EVs) are somewhere between toys and trash, a situation that will continue for the foreseeable future. So the whole auto industry is currently engaged in a trillion-dollar Prisoner’s Dilemma that goes something like this:

0. If none of the automakers go electric, the government will presumably go nuts.
1. If all of the automakers go electric, the consumers will go nuts.
2. But if most of the automakers go electric and a few don’t, the few holdouts will likely experience tremendous market gains and profitability as a consequence, while the electric sheep get SHEARED.


Avoidable Contact #93: What if you held a mandatory EV party and nobody came? | Hagerty Media
 
Jason does a pretty good job with his videos. They can be a little dry, but informative. I've linked that video somewhere here before. I always appreciate an objective look at things. The electric vehicle people can't stand to face some of the realities of all-electric vehicles, as pointed out in the video, not to mention how boring EVs are
They need to come a ways before they can be completely mainstream for many reasons. ICE did not get to this point overnight either. I like electric cars for a few reasons, much the same as liking a dishwasher or clothes washer, simple/reliable and the fewer the parts the better. Yes a electric car is boring, so is my Subaru, so is a slant six auto Duster. Basically anything you do to take control out of the vehicle will make it more boring. The unpredictability of how a car behaves is what gives it it's personality. They have been boring up cars for a long time. Our old cars are cool because they do unplanned things. I'm not talking style, just operation. Style can undo some boring, but not all.
 
I saw that video before, coulda been you @BigblueC, and I agree that the consumers don't want EV's right now. Sure, some do, but most don't. I know I don't, I have no need for one.

The presenter touched on it briefly, about planes and trains, is that electric versions make no sense, until you can get stupid power out of a cell the size of a stick of chewing gum, heavy equipment will still use ICE's to power them. Trains in the US will never have a power system laid out to fully electrify the entire network that is in use. They will always use a large diesel to turn the alternator/generator to produce the electricity to power the drive axles. Planes will probably never go electric on a large scale, maybe Jon travolta will, but probably not.

And what about large ships? Container ships need something large to power their propellers, they would probably need about twic as much mass to achieve that, and I'm just guessing. It will never be economically feasible during my lifetime. If it is, then they found some secret to the universe.

Car manufacturers want use to keep our buy-use-dispose attitude with the crap they peddle today. I'm glad my daily '08 is pretty much dependable, but it's staring to show its age and little things are going wrong with it. I'll fix those things, as it's cheaper to do that then buy something else to fix. But if I have to get something else, it'll be as old or older than what I have now.
 
es a electric car is boring, so is my Subaru, so is a slant six auto Duster

I was just thinking last night how cool it would be to have a slant six car.

I never put them in the same category as a Subaru though. Maybe it's because I never had a Golden Retriever.

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In all seriousness, that was a very good video.

I'm struggling with the thought of needing to buy a new(er) vehicle this year. We had thought about it last year, but the market dipped and our investments dropped, and then we had some unexpected expenses, so the Mercury (which is still running well) stayed in service. But while knowing that an 11 year old car is sitting in the driveway as our primary transportation is OK, sitting next to an 11 year old truck, it's still an aging piece of machinery that isn't going to magically get more reliable every year.

The thought of having to look at electric or hybrid cars just doesn't do it now, but I also wonder what after this next car, what the following one will be.

My brother, on the other hand, has embraced the technology, having bought their second Prius (first one got crashed) and his oldest son (high end IT guy married to a doctor) drives a Tesla.
 
The thought of having to look at electric or hybrid cars just doesn't do it now, but I also wonder what after this next car, what the following one will be.

If you're stuck on new cars (I consider 5 years old or less to be new), and cant stomach/don't like the idea of a disposable electric car, then you probably should buy something now. All of the manufactures are jumping on the all-electric bandwagon and are encouraging the government(s) to "force" them to do so. The article I linked above touches on that.

Curiosity, has your brother or nephew made it to the point when they have to replace the battery pack yet? Or are they the type who will simply ditch the car?
 
If you're stuck on new cars (I consider 5 years old or less to be new), and cant stomach/don't like the idea of a disposable electric car, then you probably should buy something now. All of the manufactures are jumping on the all-electric bandwagon and are encouraging the government(s) to "force" them to do so. The article I linked above touches on that.

Curiosity, has your brother or nephew made it to the point when they have to replace the battery pack yet? Or are they the type who will simply ditch the car?
I think the crashed Prius went before the battery issue would have come up.

I gotta tell you about my brother.... He's probably in the top ten of the most intelligent people I've ever known. I'm dumb as a freaking rock in comparison. He would analyze the situation, figure out the best plan economically and then ask his wife. She would say what she wanted and he would go with that. Smart man.

Since he has done well in life, the economics of either decision would be a minor bump in the road either way.

BTW, he's 81 years old and still pretty spry. I wish I could find the pic of him with the bear he shot a few years ago.

I can't tell you about how my nephew's Tesla. He's a high end IT guy married to a doctor, so it's probably a moot point and the Tesla gets traded before such problems.
 
I think the crashed Prius went before the battery issue would have come up.

I gotta tell you about my brother.... He's probably in the top ten of the most intelligent people I've ever known. I'm dumb as a freaking rock in comparison. He would analyze the situation, figure out the best plan economically and then ask his wife. She would say what she wanted and he would go with that. Smart man.

Since he has done well in life, the economics of either decision would be a minor bump in the road either way.

BTW, he's 81 years old and still pretty spry. I wish I could find the pic of him with the bear he shot a few years ago.

I can't tell you about how my nephew's Tesla. He's a high end IT guy married to a doctor, so it's probably a moot point and the Tesla gets traded before such problems.
A co-worker has a Civic hybrid and the battery went out in it. Fortunately, it was in warranty by 3 months, so he got it replaced for free. He said that the cost of the battery had he had to have paid for it was over 7k, more than the value of the car.
 
A co-worker has a Civic hybrid and the battery went out in it. Fortunately, it was in warranty by 3 months, so he got it replaced for free. He said that the cost of the battery had he had to have paid for it was over 7k, more than the value of the car.

My late son had a girlfriend with the most beat up Prius that I've ever seen. I think she was pretty rough on cars, kinda parked by feel and never did any maintenance. It didn't make any sense either, because she wasn't like that with anything else. Her house was spotless etc. Had a good job and made a decent living etc. Very smart woman too. I met her mom and she was driving a spotless black BMW, so it made even less sense.

IIRC, this was a fairly old car too. Probably the first or second year of production.

We had to jump start it once... The starter battery for the gas motor is a conventional lead acid battery, I think it's in the trunk somewhere, but they have a nice terminal up next to the engine for this.

Anyway... My point being that this car was trashed and worn to the point of if it needed tires, you wouldn't look for new ones, if you know what I mean. He told me it drove OK, but knowing him, that meant it stayed between the ditches without a lot of effort and didn't crash into the car ahead of you when you had to stop. He also said he really hated it.

Back to my point... This car obviously isn't going to get a new battery... Last I saw her, it was still going, which may be a testament to Toyota. It might also mean that you can drive it around on the gas engine with a bad battery too. Our conversations haven't been about her car.
 
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Last I saw her, it was still going, which may be a testament to Toyota. It might also mean that you can drive it around on the gas engine with a bad battery too.

I have to say, I've been impressed by some of the Prius. Not enough to go get one, but still impressed. As far as I know the hybrid vehicles, at least the older ones, will continue to run on just the gas engine with a bad battery pack. I know of two people around here who use their old Prius like little trucks hauling hundreds of pounds of stuff at times.

A co-worker has a Civic hybrid and the battery went out in it. Fortunately, it was in warranty by 3 months, so he got it replaced for free. He said that the cost of the battery had he had to have paid for it was over 7k, more than the value of the car.

That is the major downfall of the hybrid vehicles as I see it, which of course cripples the all-electric vehicle dream and makes them a no-go and extremely wasteful in my eyes. Around here a 10+ year old hybrid Civic or Prius sells for less than a similar non-hybrid salvaged vehicle, which is about 1/3 of a normal, non-salvage, non-hybrid vehicle.
 
Never thought for one minute my entire life that I'd see governments world wide would start banning ICE vehicles.
****, even 10 years ago.
:wtf:
 
You only have to look at who will make money by doing so to understand why. And no that isn't a political jab at one party. Congress and these other governments as a whole are guilty of exploiting their bs regulatory powers and financially benefiting from it.

Nancy Pelosi Buys Tesla Calls, Stands To Benefit From New Biden EV Plan

The ability of members of U.S. Congress to buy and sell stocks has been controversial over the years. One of its most prominent members made some purchases in December that could benefit from the new Biden administration.
Nancy Pelosi Buys Tesla Calls, Stands To Benefit From New Biden EV Plan
 
The manager of the Wally World I worked at had a Prius. She loved it, but drove like the older lady she was. Maybe 5 over and that was it. She claimed to have gotten 50mpg on a regular basis. She got a new one when her first Prius reached a certain mileage. It was rather low for what I remember the break even point being. So she spent X dollars more for the car over an ICE equivalent, then traded it in before saving X pennies. She didn't care, she liked the cars and was happy, so that's all that mattered to her. I've heard a lot of people have done this with their toyota hybrids. I haven't asked any tesla owners about how long they keep them before getting a new one.
 
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