1958 Fuel Injected D
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CBODY67
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(Wondering why the car was parked? FI issues? Reliability issues?
The first ElectroJector unit was prototyped in a '53 Buick, so "58 was not the first year it had been around. I remember reading that many FI cars were converted back to 2x4bbl specs. Issues like the electromagnetic radiation from overhead "Mercury vapor" street lights could affect them, etc. That first unit was a vacuum tube affair, although the later ones were probably transistorized? EMR would have required better shielding from these forces, I suspect. BUT FI was too new in '58 and few dealers knew how to work on them, by observation. Not unlike the Chevy RamJet system in that respect.
Would be a neat car for somebody to rebuild, but knowing why it was parked might be good to know.
CBODY67
The first ElectroJector unit was prototyped in a '53 Buick, so "58 was not the first year it had been around. I remember reading that many FI cars were converted back to 2x4bbl specs. Issues like the electromagnetic radiation from overhead "Mercury vapor" street lights could affect them, etc. That first unit was a vacuum tube affair, although the later ones were probably transistorized? EMR would have required better shielding from these forces, I suspect. BUT FI was too new in '58 and few dealers knew how to work on them, by observation. Not unlike the Chevy RamJet system in that respect.
Would be a neat car for somebody to rebuild, but knowing why it was parked might be good to know.
CBODY67
Xenon
Senior Member
Why is any car parked.. And for sooo many years...
A car doesn't get more rare than that one. Mesa tan, original FI car, factory dual a/c, bumper guards, power windows, seats, etc. With 5 days left on the auction, already at $15K and easily worth it despite the work needed to restore it.
Chrysler 300 Club records show it was once owned by John Fowlie, of Big M Automotive in Williams California (lots of forward look cars in his wrecking yard still). I could restore this one to be as nice as my 1957 C, as my body/paint guy is good, although he might hate me if I brought this one home. Love the car! Lets see, a C and a D sitting next to each other in my garage?????
Now if I could only get Sherwood Kahlenberg to let go of one of his 3 factory fuel injection systems - not likely from my discussion with him, as he already has 3 FI 300D cars himself for which they are destined.
For those inclined, here is a link to a writeup of the factory Electrojector system:
http://soyeur.pagesperso-orange.fr/Mopar/SAE paper on Electrojector.pdf
A beautiful 1958 Desoto Adventurer convertible has an operational factory system on it and is likely the only one in the world with a working system. Here is a link to some photos of that car:
1958Electrojector by Gary Runkel
Chrysler 300 Club records show it was once owned by John Fowlie, of Big M Automotive in Williams California (lots of forward look cars in his wrecking yard still). I could restore this one to be as nice as my 1957 C, as my body/paint guy is good, although he might hate me if I brought this one home. Love the car! Lets see, a C and a D sitting next to each other in my garage?????
Now if I could only get Sherwood Kahlenberg to let go of one of his 3 factory fuel injection systems - not likely from my discussion with him, as he already has 3 FI 300D cars himself for which they are destined.
For those inclined, here is a link to a writeup of the factory Electrojector system:
http://soyeur.pagesperso-orange.fr/Mopar/SAE paper on Electrojector.pdf
A beautiful 1958 Desoto Adventurer convertible has an operational factory system on it and is likely the only one in the world with a working system. Here is a link to some photos of that car:
1958Electrojector by Gary Runkel
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The Chevy RamJet system was a mechanical FI system as I recall, not an electronic one. The Electrojector systems in the 1958 300D were transistorized by then but were plagued still by EMI, so they were recalled. Some of the big boxes that contained the removed Electrojector systems didn't make it back to the factory, hence some original units still exist, though they would be very expensive to buy if they were available.
fc7_plumcrazy
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20 years ago I had a black 300D EFI car.
Of course without the system at all.
Just had the emblems on the quarters and of course the screwed cover in the trunk.
Carsten
Of course without the system at all.
Just had the emblems on the quarters and of course the screwed cover in the trunk.
Carsten
So young, and so ahead of your time! You should have kept it. Then I could have traded you something for it!
So young, and so ahead of your time! You should have kept it. Then I could have traded you something for it!
fc7_plumcrazy
Old Man with a Hat
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So young, and so ahead of your time! You should have kept it. Then I could have traded you something for it!
it was originally a california car that found its way over an Ohio collector to Germany.
I bought it locally back then. Drove it for two years.
I sold it to a friend of mine in England to purchase my first original Hemi Charger.
So what I got wasn't big&blue but fine for me, too.
If only I would have known
Carsten
mrfury68
Senior Member
Not a project for the faint of heart or a mediocre bank account.
If you want to know anything about Chrysler's first front a/c units in the 1957 timeframe, this guy has the full story. He was director of product planning in the 1957 timeframe. It seems like they did a better job on the 1958 models compared to the initial 1957 models:
It is amazing not only that he is still with us but that he remembers as much as he does......................
It is amazing not only that he is still with us but that he remembers as much as he does......................
desotogeorge
Member
There is some good news for anyone who has a Fuel Injected 1958 300. I am the only source in the World for the Rear Quarter Emblems ( yes the correct ones ) Put a pair of my new Emblems on that sad 300 and call it restored, save a lot of money ( HA )
CBODY67
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Yes, the Rochester RamJet system was mechanical. One article I found mentioned that on a Pontiac Bonneville with HydraMatic, that "a kid on a bike" could beat it off the line. Yet it seemed to work pretty well in Corvettes with manual transmissions.
Kind of like the Chrysler Ram Induction of that time, there were runners inside of the main housing which could be shortened to raise the rpm level of the "tuning" of the intake system. But with all of the Chevy engines it was on (small blocks of less than 350cid), I suspect it was pretty much dialed-in for that size of motor to begin with. I"ve seen mention that on the Sting Ray coupes, they would get 20mpg on the road, with a 4.56 axle ratio, which would be pretty amazing for back then, with that axle ratio, and the level of acceleration performance the vehicle had.
In one respect, I've wondered how things might have progressed IF GM had further replaced their 4bbl engines with the RJ system across the board, IF Bendix/Chrysler had better de-bugged the ElectroJector and used it on more engines, WHAT would Ford have done back then?
As with the later Tuned Port Fuel Injection of the '80s, Bendix pitched their system to GM first, but I suspect that if you back-date the first appearance of the RamJet system in Corvettes to when work on it was first started, it could well have been the Bendix system being promoted to GM that got Rochester Carb working on an "analog" system that would be less expensive to manufacture and such.
Back then, mechanical FI was all over Europe, due to their higher fuel prices and taxes, typically. They had variable-ventur_ carbs, too, plus the "performance" Weber carbs. ALL of which made the best we had in the USA look primitive. BUT our carburetors were pretty reliable and trouble-free by comparison. So, we got "what works that costs less to make".
I need to note that the RamJet fuel injection system on recent/current GM crate motors is fully electronic in nature and bears NO resemblance to the mechanical Ram Jet Fuel Injection used by Chevrolet in the later 1950s, which lasted until about '65 on Corvette 327/375 engines. Two completely different mechanisms!
CBODY67
Kind of like the Chrysler Ram Induction of that time, there were runners inside of the main housing which could be shortened to raise the rpm level of the "tuning" of the intake system. But with all of the Chevy engines it was on (small blocks of less than 350cid), I suspect it was pretty much dialed-in for that size of motor to begin with. I"ve seen mention that on the Sting Ray coupes, they would get 20mpg on the road, with a 4.56 axle ratio, which would be pretty amazing for back then, with that axle ratio, and the level of acceleration performance the vehicle had.
In one respect, I've wondered how things might have progressed IF GM had further replaced their 4bbl engines with the RJ system across the board, IF Bendix/Chrysler had better de-bugged the ElectroJector and used it on more engines, WHAT would Ford have done back then?
As with the later Tuned Port Fuel Injection of the '80s, Bendix pitched their system to GM first, but I suspect that if you back-date the first appearance of the RamJet system in Corvettes to when work on it was first started, it could well have been the Bendix system being promoted to GM that got Rochester Carb working on an "analog" system that would be less expensive to manufacture and such.
Back then, mechanical FI was all over Europe, due to their higher fuel prices and taxes, typically. They had variable-ventur_ carbs, too, plus the "performance" Weber carbs. ALL of which made the best we had in the USA look primitive. BUT our carburetors were pretty reliable and trouble-free by comparison. So, we got "what works that costs less to make".
I need to note that the RamJet fuel injection system on recent/current GM crate motors is fully electronic in nature and bears NO resemblance to the mechanical Ram Jet Fuel Injection used by Chevrolet in the later 1950s, which lasted until about '65 on Corvette 327/375 engines. Two completely different mechanisms!
CBODY67
Merely speculation on my part... the big 3 all had some form of FI available however breifly in the 50's... I suppose the motivation was to not get left behind when(if) it went mainstream. From all I've ever heard they all had problems and their dealer networks were not up to the task of diagnosing/maintaining these expensive new systems well enough to keep most of them in production.
I've always thought it was a cost/benefit issue, and the USA just wasn't the place for these at that time. It would be a losing argument to say a carburetor offered anything over FI, other than cost and (at that time) reliability. I wonder what difference embracing this earlier would have made to our IM devices and standards. Bosch CIS made it into the 90s on US spec cars, I don't know the Rochester systems very well, but understand them to be continuous injection too.
CBODY67
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In the last year of the Corvette RamJet FI, it had a 5 horsepower advantage over the Holley 3310 4bbl. Not very cost/benefit friendly, it appears. By that time, even with all of the issues with Holley 4bbls, no doubt more people could/would work on them than the OEM RamJet system.
CBODY67
CBODY67
Yeahrightgreer
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Bidding is at $30,000 with reserve not met.
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