1970 brake question

[Fireguyfire]

On my 1970 300 convertible the stance of the car when I bought it has a very forward take to it, and I want to put the car back to the factory stance which appears to be a very level stance, if not a bit nose high. Like most mopars I’m assuming that I can get the adjustment with adjusting the torsion bars, and the reason I haven’t bothered is that I want to do a full front suspension rebuild and will deal with the stance once that’s done.
The previous owner put front disc brakes on the car, from I believe a Monaco but from a similar C body.
My question is, would changing the car to front discs contribute to the stance issue, meaning would the change in the spindles be a factor? I do have the original front spindle and drum assemblies which came with the car so at least the previous owner didn’t get rid of them.
Any comments or suggestions are welcome; thought I would gather a bit of info and education before I tear into the front suspension rebuild.

 

[The_Eagles’_Nest]

The type of front brakes would have no bearing on the ride height of the car. Someone messed with the torsion bars, it’s cut and dry.

 

[Fireguyfire]

Very good; that’s what I figured as a B and E body guy, but wanted to be sure as the front end will need to come up a loooong way

 

[fury fan]

The type of front brakes would have no bearing on the ride height of the car. Someone messed with the torsion bars, it’s cut and dry.

Good pun. Unintentional I presume.

Yes, @Fireguyfire, fix that stance to what is befitting of that car.

 

[Fireguyfire]

Will do; I’ll did through the shop manual as they usually have a factory spec height measurement to the top of the wheel opening, or some other datum point.

 

[HOT FURY]

Your torsion bars may just be old and worn, Firm Feel can either recondition yours or get you factory replacements. You may be able to adjust your current ones to get a little more height but if rebuilding your suspension/steering linkage you may as well replace/recondition those too while you have them out. Make sure you get a torsion bar removal tool or make something to clamp onto the bar to remove them if you dont have one already. It's an easy job I just completely replaced everything on my fury
TORSION BARS

 

[Fireguyfire]

Is there a way to test them? I
Guessing if you tighten them all the way and the height doesn’t come into spec that would tell you.

 

[CBODY67]

When removing the torsion bars, DO use the correct clamp-on tool, period. DO check the condition of the boot seals at the rear of the bar and replace if needed. DO lube the rear hex of the bar with grease, as the FSM specifies.

Many people feel they can use the wheel opening lip to measure with, BUT that is not what the FSM specifies. The factory measurements can be a bit tedious to do. Reason is that the body can be put together a bit differently, sometimes, so using the front suspension measurements are the most accurate. Just as using the gap between the lower control arm bumper tip and where it contacts the stub-frame can be another way to get it "roughed-in", too.

When done, the rocker panel should be level with the roadway under it. Using an aligment rack can be the easiest way to find a completely level surface. Also, if you extend the line of the lower moulding or the lower edge of the rocker panel into the wheel cover, the front and rear lines should intersect the wheel cover/wheel in the exact same place, front and rear. So that means that if the rear springs are sagged, at least the car will look correct that way, with the rocker panels level with the ground.

Enjoy!
CBODY67

 

[Fireguyfire]

Great tips.
Luckily I own a torsion bar removal tool from doing many restorations

 

[Big_John]

It's really hard to tell what's going on with your car parked like that.

I'm going against the grain here and say that it isn't your front that's too low, it's your rear that's too high. When folks buy leaf springs, some like to buy the ones with a couple inches of added height. Maybe they figure the car gets better mileage because it's always going downhill... But really, they seem to like the rear higher stance. I'll bet you look under the car and there's a new set of leaf springs.

My car for reference. Note where the rear wheel is in relation to the wheel opening. And yes, I've replaced the leaf springs with stock height versions.

 

[Fireguyfire]

I did look at that with the car on the lift to see if he added a block in the rear, or changed shackles, but there is nothing like that and the springs appear to be original and are in the same shape as the rest of the underside of the car.
That doesn’t mean that the springs weren’t used ones from another car I guess.

 

[Fireguyfire]

You are definitely on to something big John as comparing the photo of your car to mine, the line of the top of the wheel arch is much higher on the rear tire than it is on your car.
I’m definitely going to investigate that rear end further.

 

[Fireguyfire]

If anybody spots something out of the ordinary, let me know but as you can see the spring appear to be the same age as the car.

 

[Big_John]

If anybody spots something out of the ordinary, let me know but as you can see the spring appear to be the same age as the car.

View attachment 578530

View attachment 578531

View attachment 578532

View attachment 578533

Looking at the second and third picture, the springs have had extra leaves added.

That means that someone has "rebuilt" the springs, and with that rebuilding, the other leaves were rearched and that usually means a higher ride height... along with a lumber wagon ride.

I would suggest new springs and one company I've used is Leaf Springs For Your Car or Light Truck 1940-1990's+ I know the shipping to Canada would be high, so maybe asking some of our Canadian members here can give you a different vendor. @cbarge might have someone.

 

[Big_John]

And just so you know, this is an added leaf. The big tell-tale is the rough cut end with no taper. It's also almost as long as the main leaf. Looks like it's been there a while, bet there's holes for a trailer hitch under there.

 

[Fireguyfire]

Excellent info, thanks.
Anyone out there in Canada have an extra set of rear leaf springs for a C body?

 

[Fireguyfire]

How many leaves would the original stock springs have had?

 

[Fireguyfire]

Is it pistons just remove the added leaf, or has the geometry of the spring been changed?

 

[Fireguyfire]

Possible, not pistons!

 

[Big_John]

Is it pistons just remove the added leaf, or has the geometry of the spring been changed?

Hard to say. It might be worth a try, but if it were me, I would have something else lined up just in case it didn't work.

IMHO, you would be better off buying new springs.. AND BE CAREFUL taking the rear shackles off. No one makes a correct replacement! I suggest you use a nut splitter on the nuts rather than trying to take them off.

Your FSM will have the leaf number listed. Download one here if you don't have one. Service Manuals – MyMopar Get a parts manual while you're at it. Parts Manuals – MyMopar