1973 Newport will not start, but sounds like it wants to! why?

[Lordofthepings777]

This car I aquired about a month ago, and have put many hours into attempting to get this baby running. She sat for 20 years, so it's a process for sure.

After rebuilding the carb, changing the starter, buying an external tank, running a line to the new and installed fuel pump, and changing the battery, I can't understand why it's not starting. Oh and the previous owner changed the distributor and coil. It sounds like it really wants to run, but every time we crank it only lasts about 10 seconds before draining the battery! Not enough time to get it up and running as a first start after 20 years. The battery I bought for it is like 890 cold cranking amps, I think 1000 regular cranking amps! that was about the biggest one I could find that would fit! Today we hooked it up to mine and a buddy's car and a spare battery all at once, and it still wouldn't start. It sputtered a few times but wouldn't idle. We have been messing with timing, but we don't think that's it. ANY advice from a mopar guy with knowledge of these cars would be great, because this is starting to become a real pain in the *** LOL. if anybody wants specific photos, I might be able to provide some, but I don't have any great ones at the moment.

Why is the battery draining so quickly? Do these cars just take a ton of power to start?...

 

[Justin Plant]

Must haves....
Good battery
Good starter
and most importantly good battery cables and connections. That doesn't mean looks good, verify they are good. Have the battery checked as well as the starter. If the cables look old and the insulation is receding, do a voltage drop test. If the voltage at each end isn't the same the amperage won't be either.
In your last quest for knowledge the very last post had some great ideas, try those then set the timing back to TDC on #1 and go from there.
Good luck!

 

[DCMC]

I saw no mention of replacing the ballast resistor, the first thing to do on a car that wants to start but sputters and dies.

 

[The_Eagles’_Nest]

No mention of trying to turn the engine by hand. No mention of the ignition control module condition. Check for a draw to make sure the battery is not draining just sitting there.

 

[Toolmanmike]

This chart get's quite involved but at least it's not just guesses like we can give. If you have a new powerful (fully charged) battery and the engine only cranks for a short time, you either have a bad starter and/or bad cables.

 

[MoPar~Man]

Spray starter fluid into the carb. Always have that stuff on hand when you are trying to start an engine that you know nothing about or you expect a hard start. You'll know very quickly if your ignition system is working, you have installed the distributor correctly, have the plugs wired correctly, etc.

 

[The_Eagles’_Nest]

Did you change the fuel pump? If you have a torn diaphragm it will not run. Make sure the new one doesn’t blowout the carburetor.

 

[CBODY67]

IF the battery is really getting drained that quickly, I suspect the cables and starter should be smoking from the heat in them!

Sounds like the prior owner had the same issues and got tired of dealing with it.

Usually, when that situation (other than the electrical part) happens, the timing chain has "jumped" or the distributor is 180 degrees out. AND the fuel pump push rod might be worn.

When the cars were new, a Group 27 battery was optional, with a Group 24 battery as standard equipment. They started FINE with the smaller battery, too! For at least three years on the battery from new.

Pull all of the spark plugs and turn the motor over with a breaker bar on the balancer bolt. See how much effort that takes.

For all of the time and effort you've already spent, plus some money, you could have rented an engine hoist, pulled the engine and put it on an engine stand, then pulled the pan to inspect the crank bearings and look for a cracked piston or similar. Which MIGHT be where you end up anyway! Look how much fun you've had in the process! As you learn more about Chrysler engines . . .

(At some point in time, three brain cells will bi-difrectionally communicate and decide "This ain't right", so what's causing it? Rather than taking the "If normal juice is not enough, we need more!" approach. Which is NOT working!!!)

Enjoy!
CBODY67

 

[DonnieRockett Karting]

This car I aquired about a month ago, and have put many hours into attempting to get this baby running. She sat for 20 years, so it's a process for sure.

After rebuilding the carb, changing the starter, buying an external tank, running a line to the new and installed fuel pump, and changing the battery, I can't understand why it's not starting. Oh and the previous owner changed the distributor and coil. It sounds like it really wants to run, but every time we crank it only lasts about 10 seconds before draining the battery! Not enough time to get it up and running as a first start after 20 years. The battery I bought for it is like 890 cold cranking amps, I think 1000 regular cranking amps! that was about the biggest one I could find that would fit! Today we hooked it up to mine and a buddy's car and a spare battery all at once, and it still wouldn't start. It sputtered a few times but wouldn't idle. We have been messing with timing, but we don't think that's it. ANY advice from a mopar guy with knowledge of these cars would be great, because this is starting to become a real pain in the *** LOL. if anybody wants specific photos, I might be able to provide some, but I don't have any great ones at the moment.

Why is the battery draining so quickly? Do these cars just take a ton of power to start?...

I just got done messing with mine, although it ran, just not well. I'd follow the flow chart, and it sounds like you have done some of the stuff already. BUT, if it sputtered, it's a quick thing to do, just advance your timing (turn distributor clockwise). After I replaced my vacuum advance, the timing was super off, and it went from starting to not starting. I gave the distributor a hefty turn to the right, and it finally fired up, and I was able to set the timing correctly. If the timing is correct on these things, once they are warmed up, they (well, mine) starts almost instantly.

 

[traintech55]

What size engine do you have? All V8'S have the same firing order, 1-8-4-3-6-5-7-2, but small block has clockwise distributor rotation, while big block has counter clock wise.

 

[Toolmanmike]

Read the OP's first post. With a new battery and starter, it only cranks for 10 seconds. Not long enough to get it started. He has issues he needs to address first before he messes with the timing or carburetor.

 

[57fury440]

Like said above, if it is only cranking for 10 seconds it is not surprising that you are having trouble getting it started. You need to find out what is causing that. Check all your cables, wires and grounds. If your timing is way out of wack, it can cause it to crank slowly. The previous owner changed the distributor, but it doesn't mean it was done correctly.

 

[Lordofthepings777]

What size engine do you have? All V8'S have the same firing order, 1-8-4-3-6-5-7-2, but small block has clockwise distributor rotation, while big block has counter clock wise.

400 CI big block 6.6L

 

[Lordofthepings777]

Like said above, if it is only cranking for 10 seconds it is not surprising that you are having trouble getting it started. You need to find out what is causing that. Check all your cables, wires and grounds. If your timing is way out of wack, it can cause it to crank slowly. The previous owner changed the distributor, but it doesn't mean it was done correctly.

@Toolmanmike

Wiring is a little concerning, but nothing points to it being “bad” other than it’s 53 years old.

Most wires are original. Even the positive cable coming off the battery is still original, could that cause that much power loss?

 

[57fury440]

If the cables look good, then make sure you have a good ground. Don't just look at it, remove the grounds, clean them and make sure. A bad ground from the starter can cause it to crank slowly.

 

[CBODY67]

Clean BOTH battery terminal posts and cable end insides with a wire brush cleaning item. They need to be shiny silver rather than otherwise.

CBODY67

 

[1970FuryConv]

@Toolmanmike

Wiring is a little concerning, but nothing points to it being “bad” other than it’s 53 years old.

Most wires are original. Even the positive cable coming off the battery is still original, could that cause that much power loss?

If your cables are OK and your battery drains after 10 seconds trying to start, I suspect severe starter draw. Like something disastrous is going on with your starter and it needs replacement.
An option is a 1994 Dodge Magnum V8 mini starter. Will give your car much faster starting rotation and far less battery drain.
FCBO member @Badvert65 sells the terminal relocatoin ship that renders the ministarter a bolt on. eBay link below
For Mopar: Premium mini starter conversion/relocation terminal Kit | eBay

 

[Lordofthepings777]

If your cables are OK and your battery drains after 10 seconds trying to start, I suspect severe starter draw. Like something disastrous is going on with your starter and it needs replacement.
An option is a 1994 Dodge Magnum V8 mini starter. Will give your car much faster starting rotation and far less battery drain.
FCBO member @Badvert65 sells the terminal relocatoin ship that renders the ministarter a bolt on. eBay link below
For Mopar: Premium mini starter conversion/relocation terminal Kit | eBay

I replaced the starter already with a new Duralast one. The last one it had was faulty and I was able to get a brand new one free. It cranks okay I suppose, like I said it almost fired up. But my battery is a 1000 cranking amps battery if I'm remembering right. I don't feel like it should be taking this much power.

If the battery drops below like 12.5 volts, there's no chance to get a good crank out of it. It drops to like 9.6V while cranking if it starts out below 13 something. Very weird that it's taking this much power.

 

[Lordofthepings777]

If the cables look good, then make sure you have a good ground. Don't just look at it, remove the grounds, clean them and make sure. A bad ground from the starter can cause it to crank slowly.

We had the grounds checked as the first thing. We cleaned most of them up and even added a new ground wire. This was before we changed the starter. I also cleaned the wire of the positive and replaced battery terminals on the wire so it had a better connection, but if its the wire itself I am unsure.

My buddy said this is one of those things where I'm just going to have to brute force it and keep trying banging my head against the wall till something works lol. We will see.

 

[CBODY67]

My buddy said this is one of those things where I'm just going to have to brute force it and keep trying banging my head against the wall till something works lol. We will see.

Better get those NEURON TERMINALS cleaned! You have an issue that is NOT normal! By ANY stretch of the imagination! How long have y'all been trying to "power your way" through it and NO real progress??? Sometimes, you have to change direction/route to get to where you desire to be!

What ign module is on the car now? This is important as they have a minimum voltage requirement just to fire the plugs. For the least voltage requirement, it needs to be the OEM-style box ONLY. The hot rod versions take more voltage, even up to about 13V, as specified in the old Direct Connection Race Manual.

The excessive voltage drain is obviously due to excessive internal engine friction. Defective new parts might be one part of the equation, too, but you're past that by now, I suspect.

Have you pulled the spark plugs and tried to turn the engine with the balancer bolt to check for internal friction? It will not be easy, but it should not be excessive hard, either. Verified that #1 plug is at TDC when #1 plug is firing?

Define "slow crank". Is it visibly slow cranking speed? Is it "hard to start" cranking time?

Your "buddies" might know more about cars than you do, but WHY are y'all still not accomplishing anything? Other than bruised heads.

CBODY67