any 2nd supporters here that can help out?

Knebel

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Dont know if it okay to post here.. but.. I am trying to do what i can to help my community. Anyone here who would be willing to send an email to two senators about Opposing SB501?

SB501 states that you can "only buy 20rds a month" and "bans magazines greater than 5rds".
I can either publish their email addresses here or send them via PM. We have to stop this crap you guys, its all unconstitutional and for most, its written by teenagers who dont know what they are talking about!!!!
 
Over view and explanation of this measure google: Oregon Bill would require Permits to buy Guns, limit Ammunition.
 
This is why I moved away from the left coast. Why do you think they call it left?
 
Time to stock up, then.

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Sounds very similar to some of the New York State "Safe" act.

Best to get people from Oregon to respond. They aren't going to listen to people outside your state.
 
Sounds very similar to some of the New York State "Safe" act.

Best to get people from Oregon to respond. They aren't going to listen to people outside your state.


They wont know. Send an email saying that as a "citizen of the USA and voter, you oppose this".
 
Dave. Yes, permits, yes limit ammo. But you have to dig a little deeper than the headline!

Somehow, the fact that I might need a permit to exercise my 2nd Amendment rights is more than a little offensive. Don't need to know a whole lot more to oppose this POS bill.

Dave
 
Somehow, the fact that I might need a permit to exercise my 2nd Amendment rights is more than a little offensive. Don't need to know a whole lot more to oppose this POS bill.

Dave

Okay then I misinterpreted your Post :). And yes, the sheriff will decide, PLUS its a permit FOR EVERY PURCHASE. Its always like...the general idea might be ..."okay" but... they overshoot because they want a 100% ban. And suddenly you are a criminal overnight because you can put 20rd in your mag instead of 5. Or...my 1911 with 7rds or a 6 shot revolver... This bill was done by kids who arent even eligible to buy firearms and now they want to take my right away? Not to mention all rich kids from Lake oswego.. and the senator sits in his $1.5mio mansion ontop of a hill with private security.

I am not even American but I also come from somwhere where self defense "weapons" are widely forbidden.. I read every day in my foreign news how that works out and then have Politicans say "oh well thats how it is now..if you dont want to get robbed/raped/murdered...dont go outside after dark"
 
Okay then I misinterpreted your Post :). And yes, the sheriff will decide, PLUS its a permit FOR EVERY PURCHASE. Its always like...the general idea might be ..."okay" but... they overshoot because they want a 100% ban. And suddenly you are a criminal overnight because you can put 20rd in your mag instead of 5. This bill was done by kids who arent even eligible to buy firearms and now they want to take my right away? Not to mention all rich kids from Lake oswego.. and the senator sits in his $1.5mio mansion ontop of a hill with private security.

I am not even American but I also come from somwhere where self defense "weapons" are widely forbidden.. I read every day in my foreign news how that works out and then have Politicans say "oh well thats how it is now..if you dont want to get robbed/raped/murdered...dont go outside after dark"

Where do you hail from?

Dave
 
I also have Polish ancestors. MY grandpa and his siblings were "relocated" by the Nazis from what is now part of poland.

*relocated means they fled by foot in fear of being killed.
 
Most of my magazines are all about cars. The vintage "Playboy" and "Penthouse" ones are under the bed. My "2nd Amendment right to bear arms" is when I wear a sleeveless t-shirt or not one at all. Be that as it may . . .

So, a key issue is that any law can be passed, but until FUNDING is also passed to implement and execute the legislation, it's meaningless. How many ammo owners are there in comparison to the number of "people" who might come and get your stash of firearms and ammo? Seems like the law enforcement people would be severely out-numbered!

To me, to talk about "the kids" not knowing anything is severely minimalizing what THEY have seen in their young lives, which is unfortunate. Although some might disagree. Be that as it may.

Rather than getting all paranoid that anybody might know how much ammo you're buying/stashing/hoarding, why not push for a psychological test of anybody buying guns instead? Another huge barrel of worms! The ammo just acts upon the desires of the person holding the gun. More research into what trips those shooters' triggers (mentally) so that we can all be safer. Unfortunately, one way to signal that something might be "wrong" is by ammo purchases, legally permitted or not.

But, too, record keeping is another issue. That guy who shot up the small-town church in TX had several red flags in his past, which should have kept him from buying ammo, much less a gun. But being a military person, everybody knew he should have known how to use a gun, so it happened.

The few times I've sent an email to an elected official, it comes back "Recipient mailbox full. Non-deliverable". In looking up a federal legislator who's on a particular committee, I've even found dialogue on their website that they want to hear ONLY From people in their district (who might elect them) rather than somebody else which might have an interest in the legislative proposals they have before them. In the SEMA links to legislators, they have worked, which resulted in a confirmation email . . . and getting put on their email list to tell you what a good job they are doing. A mixed bag.

When I was growing up and in high school in the later '60s Texas, it was not uncommon to see pickups with a gun rack in the back window. With unloaded guns in them. As a normal situation, even at school. Even in gun racks in Jeeps of that era, no top or doors. It was a different world back then. If you had a gun, it was to serve some purpose for shooting at coyotes and such on the farm, shooting buzzards, or for normal hunting activities. IF you had some cherished "bird hunting" guns, they were usually locked up somewhere. When it got to where everybody seemed to believe they need a gun "for protection" and target shooting only, that's when things started to change, from what I recall.

It disturbs me when I see a "guns rights" protest on tv, where I see plus-sized ladies with their young child in one arm and a shotgun/assault rifle in the other arm, it makes me pause as to what kind of signal that's sending. She might really know how to use it, even have a license to carry it, but to me, the optics of that scene is out of whack. A totally different thing when former TX Governor Ann Richards was pictures on a Harley holding a rifle.

Having grown up in TX and still living in TX, I have seen the gun issue evolve from "a necessary tool for the farmers/ranchers" to what the guns issue has become. It's become a status symbol to have a gun or a particular style/type/brand. Gun "swap meets" are big business, which increases every time some "2nd Amendment" stuff gets talked about. The NRA, which was originally about responsible use of firearms, plus teaching HOW to use them, is now much more politically motivated than in prior times. Which seems to partially drive the frenzy regarding private gun ownership, from what I've seen.

Might "they" come after your guns? Consider how many people it would take to do that, in just one area of the country ad one specified time? Mobilizing the military? Not really an option, all things considered. Just not enough to do it as many seem to perceive. Local people? Not nearly enough. In other words, it won't happen overnight and once word gets out, everything vanishes. More gun and ammo owners than the people who might come after it. Bad odds! Too much money to make it happen, too! Not to mention the disposal/destruction activities' costs. Just think about the dynamics of all of these things!

In other words, these permits your excited about are just a band-aid fix at best. More of an inconvenience than anything else, plus possibly a little $$ for each permit. Online sales can probably still happen, though, unregulated. Which are still trackable, if desired. In the mean time, the ones who benefit from all of this frenzy keep making money! NRA memberships too.

If you're worried about others knowing what you've got/accumulated, then it all needs to be locked up in a secure location lest anybody try to steal it. Or just sell most of it so there won't be anything for anybody to steal. Taking away the "food source", so to speak. Lots of other possible conversations in this mix, too!

Just some respectful thoughts,
CBODY67
 
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Most of my magazines are all about cars. The vintage "Playboy" and "Penthouse" ones are under the bed. My "2nd Amendment right to bear arms" is when I wear a sleeveless t-shirt or not one at all. Be that as it may . . .

So, a key issue is that any law can be passed, but until FUNDING is also passed to implement and execute the legislation, it's meaningless. How many ammo owners are there in comparison to the number of "people" who might come and get your stash of firearms and ammo? Seems like the law enforcement people would be severely out-numbered!

To me, to talk about "the kids" not knowing anything is severely minimalizing what THEY have seen in their young lives, which is unfortunate. Although some might disagree. Be that as it may.

Rather than getting all paranoid that anybody might know how much ammo you're buying/stashing/hoarding, why not push for a psychological test of anybody buying guns instead? Another huge barrel of worms! The ammo just acts upon the desires of the person holding the gun. More research into what trips those shooters' triggers (mentally) so that we can all be safer. Unfortunately, one way to signal that something might be "wrong" is by ammo purchases, legally permitted or not.

But, too, record keeping is another issue. That guy who shot up the small-town church in TX had several red flags in his past, which should have kept him from buying ammo, much less a gun. But being a military person, everybody knew he should have known how to use a gun, so it happened.

The few times I've sent an email to an elected official, it comes back "Recipient mailbox full. Non-deliverable". In looking up a federal legislator who's on a particular committee, I've even found dialogue on their website that they want to hear ONLY From people in their district (who might elect them) rather than somebody else which might have an interest in the legislative proposals they have before them. In the SEMA links to legislators, they have worked, which resulted in a confirmation email . . . and getting put on their email list to tell you what a good job they are doing. A mixed bag.

When I was growing up an din high school in the later '60s, it was not uncommon to see pickups with a gun rack in the back window. With unloaded guns in them. As a normal situation, even at school. Even in gun racks in Jeeps of that era, no top or doors. It was a different world back then. If you had a gun, it was to serve some purpose for shooting at coyotes and such on the farm, shooting buzzards, or for normal hunting activities. When it got to where everybody seems to believe they need a gun "for protection" and target shooting only, that's when things started to change, from what I recall.

It disturbs me when I see a "guns rights" protest on tv, where I see plus-sized ladies with their young child in one arm and a shotgun/assault rifle in the other arm, it makes me pause as to what kind of signal that's sending. She might really know how to use it, even have a license to carry it, but to me, the optics of that scene is out of whack. A totally different thing when former TX Governor Ann Richards was pictures on a Harley holding a rifle.

Just some respectful thoughts,
CBODY67

Willis:

I taught NRA classes for 20 years and I was a military range NCO before that. I will tell you unequivocally that there are plenty of folks who have no business anywhere near a firearm. Not because they have any evil intent, but more because of poor eyesight, poor coordination and very low IQ's, so low they could not understand the basics. The military drafted lots of these folks and many of them wound up assigned to line units. To me it always seem immoral to assign such individuals to a combat posting, but I had little control over duty assignments.

In NRA classes, we had a lot more control and could weed out the individuals who we felt were unable to shoot safely. I flunked out some military veterans who should have been well trained but were not and would not follow safe shooting practices. Being a fat lady does not make one unqualified to shoot. I trained some robust grandmotherly types who were experts at marksmanship. If you have guns in the home, it is important to impress on youngsters every aspect of gun safety. Bringing a kid to a gun range and having them sit in on safety classes is good training even if they are not old enough to shoot. They will at least learn not to ever touch a firearm without adult supervision. The more people that tell them about safety, the more likely they are to remember.

I find the argument for psychological testing to be a red herring. It is a process that is easily abused. I think back to the Soviet Gulag where dissidents were denied employment, housing and the right to vote because they were considered ideologically hostile. "Politically incorrect" in today's terms. Many were assigned to reeducation centers or institutions for the insane. We are not there yet, but tests can be set up in such a way as to deny most people the right to own a firearm. The risk is not worth the potential gains.

So I have to respectfully disagree with most of you post.

Dave
 
Dave, I will concur on the bulk of your comments, especially the issue of psychological testing. There are already laws on the books which should have sent up the red flags about the TX church shooter, but record keeping/transfer were not what they should have been. Even if he had a recent military enlistment heritage.

I grew up watching westerns on tv. Roy Rogers, Wild Bill Hickock, Lone Ranger, etc. Guns were an everyday thing in the eras depicted by those tv shows. Everybody that had a gun, needed one, typically, and knew how to best use it. One of the key things, possibly, was that everybody was usually "equally-gunned" in firepower. So it was a more even situation in a gun fight, possibly.

Unlike when the Tower Shooter at the Univ of TX took to the bell tower at the Austin campus in the middle '60s. The shooter had high-powered rifles whereas the police that came after him only had hand guns. It was noted that all of the guys that had deer rifles in their dorms or pickup trucks went to get them for a more even situation to seek to take the shooter out before he killed more people.

It's fantastic that you taught responsible gun use to those that were receiving the training. I feel that's as it should be--period. I had many friends who went out hunting on their property on weekends, made annual treks to the mountains each year for deer an such, or seasonal bird hunts. It was a "deal" to go to "the lease" for these events. It was a part of their lives, for many years. No problems with that!

I appreciate the mechanical and engineering aspects of guns which make them what they are. Not unlike a similar appreciation I have for automotive engineering and such. Some guns are incredibly simplistic, too.

In some of the shootings of more recent times, I wonder why any individual would go into a random venue, shoot and kill people, and seek to make a statement of sorts by their actions? To me, that is the area of psychological research that we might never be able to effectively evaluate. Why was the guy in Las Vegas targeting that country music event, to the extent that he did? Yet in some of the shootings, there seemed to be some more personal reasons involved. Targeting specific groups or individuals rather than complete randomness. Lots of questions and speculative answers that can't be processed or dealt with, it seems. Unfortunately, as has been mentioned elsewhere, "Thoughts and prayers aren't enough . . . " As with other things, there might not be an answer in our lifetimes, amid all of the dialogue that claims there should be, however that might happen.

CBODY67
 
They choose the places they choose because they are areas restricted from legally having a gun. When you consider that it kind of proves the adage that only criminals will have guns.
The second amendment is a right, not permission from the government. If we all accept them putting conditions on having that right it will at that point be just like a drivers license, a privilege granted by the government. And their track record on open, honest and fair speaks to itself. It is non of uncle Sam's business about how much ammo anyone ownes.



Dave, I will concur on the bulk of your comments, especially the issue of psychological testing. There are already laws on the books which should have sent up the red flags about the TX church shooter, but record keeping/transfer were not what they should have been. Even if he had a recent military enlistment heritage.

I grew up watching westerns on tv. Roy Rogers, Wild Bill Hickock, Lone Ranger, etc. Guns were an everyday thing in the eras depicted by those tv shows. Everybody that had a gun, needed one, typically, and knew how to best use it. One of the key things, possibly, was that everybody was usually "equally-gunned" in firepower. So it was a more even situation in a gun fight, possibly.

Unlike when the Tower Shooter at the Univ of TX took to the bell tower at the Austin campus in the middle '60s. The shooter had high-powered rifles whereas the police that came after him only had hand guns. It was noted that all of the guys that had deer rifles in their dorms or pickup trucks went to get them for a more even situation to seek to take the shooter out before he killed more people.

It's fantastic that you taught responsible gun use to those that were receiving the training. I feel that's as it should be--period. I had many friends who went out hunting on their property on weekends, made annual treks to the mountains each year for deer an such, or seasonal bird hunts. It was a "deal" to go to "the lease" for these events. It was a part of their lives, for many years. No problems with that!

I appreciate the mechanical and engineering aspects of guns which make them what they are. Not unlike a similar appreciation I have for automotive engineering and such. Some guns are incredibly simplistic, too.

In some of the shootings of more recent times, I wonder why any individual would go into a random venue, shoot and kill people, and seek to make a statement of sorts by their actions? To me, that is the area of psychological research that we might never be able to effectively evaluate. Why was the guy in Las Vegas targeting that country music event, to the extent that he did? Yet in some of the shootings, there seemed to be some more personal reasons involved. Targeting specific groups or individuals rather than complete randomness. Lots of questions and speculative answers that can't be processed or dealt with, it seems. Unfortunately, as has been mentioned elsewhere, "Thoughts and prayers aren't enough . . . " As with other things, there might not be an answer in our lifetimes, amid all of the dialogue that claims there should be, however that might happen.

CBODY67
 
They keep trying to push nonsense like this in NC as well. While we do have a Permit-To-Purchase system for pistols, I have a NCCCP which exempts me from that, and I just renew every 5 years- and I carry concealed. I'm not a fan of 2A restrictive laws whatsoever, it is a shame there is such a mental health issue in our world. Oh, and my brother lives in Beaverton, and he's prior service USMC. I'll see if I can get him to invest a little interest.
 
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