Charging issue. Please Help

[Daniel Orozco]

i have a 1965 fury and it had a new alternator, battery, and voltage regulator when I bought it. A few weeks later it would not hold a charge. I replaced damaged looking wires but my number one suspect was the voltage regulator. I opened it and a wire on one side had burned. I figured it was due to one of the shorts I had found so I sodered a new wire and gave it a shot. I turned her on and almost immediately the whole engine bay filled with smoke. I shut everything off and when it all cleared the only noticeable damage was the field wire that runs from the alternator to the regulator was completely toasted. I haven’t been able to find any other damage but what would cause this? Also, I had a multimeter running at the time it happened and the reading had shot down. I’ve looked everywhere but haven’t been able to find answers. Any help is greatly appreciated.

 

[Davea Lux]

Start by taking the "repaired" voltage regulator and throwing it into the trash, You should never try to repair a smoked regulator. You will need to fabricate a new field wire to the alternator. The regulator supplies power to the alternator field to energize the charging process. My best guess is that you may now have a shorted field due to the faulty regulator. Run a length of wire from the field terminal that is long enough to reach the positive battery cable, leave it unhooked until you start the car. Start the car, and touch the wire to the positive cable on the battery, if the wire starts to heat up quickly, the field on the alternator is toast and you will need a new unit. If the wire does not heat up, check the amp gauge, is the car showing a charge? If so the alternator is probably not damaged. Remove the test wire and replace the wiring to the alternator field. Install a new regulator and start the car, if it charges, that much of the problem is repaired. Be sure that the regulator has a good ground. Shut off the car and run a test light from the positive battery terminal to the unhooked positive battery cable. If you get a glowing test light, you have a short someplace that needs to be found and corrected. Be sure that all accessories are off when running this test, might have to remove the fuse from the clock if the car has one. If you do not get a glowing test light, you probably do not have a steady short in the vehicles electrical system. Leave the battery cable unhooked overnight to see if it holds a charge, if it does not, the battery is defective.

Note that new components on a vehicle do not necessarily mean that they will work, the quality of many of today's rebuilt alternators is crap because they now only fix the part that failed, other components are often at the point of failure. After market voltage regulators that are made in China are always crap so try to stick will a US made brand, Napa still sells them as do other quality auto parts. You won't find quality electrical components at Auto Zone or Car Quest. Good luck.

Dave

 

[CBODY67]

Howdy and welcome aboard.

For general principles, check each of the diodes in the alternator to see if they are indeed "one way switches". A bad one can result in a battery drain situation. Even if it is "new". It might not be an issue with the older cars, but many modern ones will fry an alternator when hooked to a dead battery. The voltage regulator sees "max load" and allows that to happen, which can cook the alternator guts and possibly some other things of questionable integrity in the circuit. So, make sure the battery is charged, too.

Just some thoughts,
CBODY67

 

[Gerald Morris]

You had an old style regulator, which has sentimental value and if you have an original car, possible monetary value but ONLY then. There's a fellow in this forum who sells voltage regulators. His eBay page lists them as out of stock right now (FuryGT) but I see some that look quite similar here:

Chrysler Plymouth Voltage Regulator Electronic Solid State Dodge Mopar Body A B | eBay

Best of all, these are made in the good old U.$.A.and are the best you can get for the $ right now!

I bought one after 2 sino-excrement ones from Vatozone gave me dismal results. DON'T WASTE a cent on that **** bro. Get the good ones I mentioned.

I had a nasty short in an alternator not long after I bought my 66 Newport 3 yrs ago and had to rewire a fair portion of the power circuits under the hood and dash. I still have some vestiges of that fire, but have had a safe, functional harness for over 3 years despite these. While working on my steering this Turkey Day I got the chance to clean up some of my "temporary" connections, making for a safer ride yet.

I use VatoZone's crappy alternators for the present only because they honor the "lifetime warranty" for me without argument. On average, about every 9 months I get a new one, all included in the initial $60 + tax I paid for the first one. If you can afford better up front, go that road, but if you're Low Budget as I am, then this deal can be worked to your advantage, provided it doesn't burn the rest of your wiring harness.

To avoid that, be SURE to have fusible links in place protecting all your primary power circuitry. Let NO conductor go unprotected beyond the one to the starter motor, which is momentary contact. I still keep a sharp eye on that one and protect it with secondary insulation over most of its length.

Whatever you do, try to get the best quality parts you can afford. Upgrade when you can. I do, when I can. Low quality always runs more in the long run, so bear that in mind when you get cheap crap. I barely got a month out of some sino-**** bearings vended by Guess Who? before I HAD to replace them with the Timkens I had the sense to get soon as I could. Good thing that too, as I was working; using the car for the job and couldn't afford a lost day.

Some local motor shops can rebuild an alternator competently for you. If you know of one, take a core to them and work a deal. You can often get a shop to rebuild one with a heavy duty stator, diodes and such for a few bucks extra for those parts. I don't need more than 60 amps yet, so I do alright with Duralaughs for now....

 

[70bigblockdodge]

Your new parts are all most likely smoked, best case is battery survived.
My best guess is original problem was field bush/wire shorted burning the wire in regulator and welding the points replacing that caused it to try and full field the alternator which usually burns the rotor winding(field wire) off internally, before it melts the field wire.

 

[65sporty]

I would pull the alternator and have it tested, any rebuilders in your area? I trust my guy more than the auto parts. Test the battery, run new wire for the field. This should get you back on track.

 

[Daniel Orozco]

Hey guys sorry for the late reply. I had to put the car on hold and finally have free time. Thank you all for all the tips. I currently have tried the field wire to the pos on the battery and the charge immediately shot down. From what y’all posted, it’s toast. I am going to buy a new alt and voltage regulator and give them a shot. Is there anything that would cause the same issue again? I currently don’t have a drain in the car. Also I read in a different post that you can conduct a by briefly connect the two wires that go to the regular to see if you get a charge. I assume that’s not much different than connecting the alt to the battery, but I gave that a shot prior to the field wire burning and that shot sparks. The alt was also tested prior to the incident and was good. Im hoping a new alt and regulator will do, but I have a gut feeling there is a deeper problem. What role does the ammeter play in the charging system? Should I change that out too? Thanks

 

[65sporty]

The way the field wire was melted it was either shorted to ground or was overcharging badly. The ammeter is after the alternator and should not cause this problem.

 

[Daniel Orozco]

Thank you. I tried to order an ammeter at the parts store and they don’t have it so I will order one online. I have an alternator and regulator on the way and will arrive this afternoon. I took the alternator to get tested at 3 separate store and it passed twice, failed once. It’s hit or miss so I’m going to buy a new one. It sucks because the one I’m replacing is new haha. My fault.

 

[Daniel Orozco]

 

[65sporty]

I wouldn't waste my time with the ammeter, most guy's bypass them because all the vehicle power goes through it. A volt meter is better

 

[jct]

I've done something similar to this
Some considerations about the charging and wiring upgrade and your worries about

 

[Gerald Morris]

BYPASS THAT AMMETER!!! Read this:

Catalog

And this:

Improved Wiring for older Mopars

Anyway, cut that ammeter OUT of your circuit and just direct connect it as in the second page of the MAD article, Diagram B

I went one up from this program, given how by doing this, one is merely parallel wiring from the starter relay lug to the welded splice. I eliminated the original 2 wires, and ran JUST ONE 10 GAUGE direct through the firewall to the junction originally welded. I tap the switched power bus of the fuse box w a voltage meter gauge instead, making an electrically safer circuit. I use a 60 A alternator too, which I feed from with a #8 AWG feed to the battery, with a # 12 AWG fusible link running the last 6 inches between the #8 feed to the + battery terminal. I use a split bolt to join the wires, and tape it with rubber, then cloth tape, as one should with split bolt connections. THIS makes for quick, safe connections at the fusible link to main feed junction, AND allows rapid replacement. One need only crimp a new ring terminal, (and solder for electro-mech security. Use shrink-wrap over the connection) to the fusible link wire, which should be cut at 7 inches, then have 1/2 inch stripped off each end. The end put into the split bolt can be tinned if concerned about fraying or "wicking." I normally just dab a little dielectric grease onto the end as well as onto the split bolt. Go light with the grease there, as you WILL want to wrap the bolt WELL with rubber tape! I use ONLY 3M rubber tape for these. After rubber tape, you can use either 3M cloth tape OR gaffer's tape to assure good insulation while maintaining easy access to the splice. Hopefully, you won't NEED to replace fusible links often.

I also place another 12 gauge link between battery terminal and the #8 AWG feed going from the + terminal to the starter relay.

If you're in the field and have a big short, you can always quickly replace the fusible link wire just by splicing it into the split bolt with the #8, and taping it up, then connecting it to the positive terminal. Cheap terminals will even allow you to slide the wire in along with the big starter wire (#4 AWG) but cheap terminals STRETCH, and lead being NON-elastic, once stretched they become useless. I upgraded to a marine type terminal for my negative, with a couple big 7/16 inch ring terminals to my two grounds. This allows me to easily disconnect the ground just by loosening a wingnut and then re-connecting by tightening the same. I plan to replace the positive terminal with the same sort of terminal next time I need to replace one. For the present, the cheap one is new and gives me no trouble.

I hope you find some helpful inspiration from this. Good luck!