Is a 1967 440 HP Engine in a Chrysler automatically a TNT?

Engine, Transmission & Driveline

  1. Camshaft

    Camshaft Member

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    Found a parts car in the Interior of the Province, 1967 Chrysler 300, has the 440 with the HP on the pad, but does not have the HP manifolds, or other tell tale signs of being a TNT car. Perhaps the manifolds and air cleaner etc were replaced, but wondering if this is realistic? Trying to get the Seller to shovel the snow off of it to give me the VIN # but he is elderly and reluctant to do this. CG
     
  2. oldkimmer

    oldkimmer Member

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    Chrysler did weird shit back in the day. Should have a dual snorkel air cleaner as well. Mine did. Good luck 2 ya. Kim
     
  3. Davea Lux

    Davea Lux Old Man with a Hat FCBO Gold Member

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    The HP stamp was used to designate the steel crankshaft, does not necessarily mean it was a TNT. Nearly all 440 blocks in '67 will bear the HP stamp. A correct '67 engine will have the code C 440 also stamped on the pad. Log manifolds were used on the 350 horse engines, HP manifolds on the 375 horse engines. Owner can also access the VIN from the title or registration if he does not want to shovel snow.

    Dave
     
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  4. 413

    413 Well-Known Member

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    Dave I can’t agree with this. All 1967 440’s had a steel crank. HP means HP and nothing else. L code VIN

    @Camshaft , does the hood open? Read the fender tag codes. That tells the engine also.
    If the pad has HP then when new it had all the goodies on it. But that was 54 years ago so things get changed. Also the HP stamp could have been added.
    @Camshaft
    ABA20E6E-65F4-4B07-B14E-47A99374D988.jpeg
     
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2021
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  5. saylor

    saylor Senior Member

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    from 440 source
    There is absolutely no physical difference between a block with an HP or HP2 stamp and one without.

    All blocks were cast and machined at the foundry, and then assembled at Chrysler's 2.1 million square foot Trenton assembly plant in Trenton, Michigan. During assembly, if the engine was given high performance cam and valve springs, or in some cases other items that differed between HP and non-HP engines such as: six pack rods, carbs, etc., then the engines ID pad would be stamped with HP. All blocks originally came from the same place, and there is absolutely no difference in cylinder wall thickness, nickel content in the cast iron, strengthening ribs on side of the block by the freeze plugs (see below for the real story on this,) or any of the other myths you have heard. The number 2, which you may find after the HP, (or in the case of non HP blocks, you may find just a "2" by itself, usually in the lower right hand corner of the ID pad) refers to the shift during which the engine was assembled. In running a factory, one 24 hour day can be divided into three 8 hour shifts. The first shift was considered a "1" however to save time, Chrysler did not stamp a "1", they just left it blank. So an HP2 engine, only means that the engine happened to be assembled on the second shift. There is no advantage to an HP2 block over an HP. we have never seen an HP3, (or just a "3") although Chrysler does allow for it in their documentation, so let me know if you have one or have seen one. Also of note is that non-HP engines usually used the same heads, intake manifold, and many other parts, which is great since it makes it a lot easier to bring a non-HP engine up to the power levels of a factory HP and beyond. But unless you are doing an original restoration, don't worry about finding and/or paying extra for an HP block.
     
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  6. polara66hardtop

    polara66hardtop Senior Member

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    my 67 440HP Has the 83 code for TNT, look for that, and the L in fifth digit.
    EJ: CE23L77xxxxxx
    this is the economy newport with the TNT. the manifolds are not the same and do not look the same as a B body HP engine.
     
  7. polara66hardtop

    polara66hardtop Senior Member

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    here is the driver side of an original HP C body car.

    1967 440HP manifolds 1 July 2016 014.JPG
     
  8. Big_John

    Big_John Illegitimi non carborundum FCBO Gold Member

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    More likely, the engine was replaced at some time and a HP block got into the mix. Either the entire engine, the short block or just the block (in the case of a reman engine) is from an HP car and it ended up in that car.

    Either way, it's a parts car. Does it make a big difference?
     
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  9. MrMoparCHP

    MrMoparCHP Senior Member

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    When I got my recent 69 Polara it had non HP manifolds on it, it was the original engine and it is an HP 440 car, for some reason they were swapped.

    Yours may have been as well.


    Alan
     
  10. Davea Lux

    Davea Lux Old Man with a Hat FCBO Gold Member

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    I agree that they all had steel shafts but a lot of the 350 horse engines still have the HP stamp on the pad. I have one in my '70 sport fury with an original T-Code engine. The blocks were pre-sorted units with minimal cylinder migration to be used for HP built engines. Not all of them wound up being used for that purpose which is why some 350 horse engines sometimes bear the HP stamp.

    Dave
     
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  11. 69CoronetRT

    69CoronetRT Senior Member

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    HP signifies the cam and drivetrain used in the 375 horse assembly. Otherwise, what other external markings are used to facilitate the final assembly?
     
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  12. CBODY67

    CBODY67 Old Man with a Hat

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    Treat your "find" as a mere parts car only, so that you don't over-pay for it based on the "muscle car engine" it might have in it. If the VIN checks out, fine. If it doesn't, then you didn't pay too much for it. At this point in time, you never know what's in the engine until you pull it apart to see!

    Enjoy!
    CBODY67
     
  13. twostick

    twostick Senior Member

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    I've seen a 69 T&C that had a 350 horsepower 440 and an HP block. When we tore it down it had 6pak style rods and IIRC a roller chain that was as worn out as I've ever seen. 200,000 on it and the crank could make close to a quarter turn before the rotor moved. You could push both sides of the chain to the middle and they didn't lack much from touching.

    Kevin
     
  14. moper

    moper Well-Known Member

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    I know of no sorting of the locks and having tested a bunch there’s no way HP were any less core shifted than non HP.
     
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