'Ol Bess (1966 Crown Imperial) is home. What an adventure.

[Mick]

Got up yesterday morning at zero dark thirty on a flight out of Louisville with my awesome co-pilot Ginny, to Omaha, Nebraska. We got picked up from the airport by the gentleman (Don Peers) that did my pre-purchase inspection (for the credit union). Treated us like family and got us hooked up with the seller. We took him and his wife to lunch and saw a little bit of Omaha.
Okay, the car had been at a shop in York, Nebraska, getting looked over and agreed upon repairs made to Bess, pre-purchase. The a/c, (which had a new compressor, wasn't blowing cold and there was an exhaust leak at that exhaust butterfly/heat rise valve (is that what it's called?) These guys (Skip's in York) have a solid reputation, and after some discussion, decided that the valve just needed to go. Cool. They took both exhaust manifolds off, shaved them, and put gaskets on them. Refilled a/c, and try as they might, could find no leak. Good to go.
Got the car, quiet as could be and cold a/c. Get on the road, somewhere in Missouri I think, or was it Iowa? Anyway, a damn coyote (believe it or not) trots-not runs-across the interstate. Time to test those big beautiful power drum brakes. Bess tries to send me into a ditch. Right side grabbed; driver side not so much. Didn't notice this in drive around Omaha, and may have developed just then. Midway through Missouri, heard that unmistakable exhaust leak start up. Next gas stop, popped the hood and sure enough, another leak, this time from the driver side. Did they just not torque it down or what? I can also confirm she has original headlights...Anyway, made it home in one piece and and look forward to working on her.

 

[Ross Wooldridge]

Glad you're home safely. Retorque the exhaust manifolds.

Front drums may need adjustment - they often pull on harder stops but seek OK around town...

 

[Big_John]

They took both exhaust manifolds off, shaved them, and put gaskets on them.

No gaskets needed under the exhaust manifold. The factory never used them. It's not worth pulling them off at this point though.

You may get away with retorqing the bolts if the gasket hasn't blown out. The bolts heat and expand, cool and contract etc. after driving the car and they stretch. When I put exhaust manifolds on, I drive it a time or two and then tighten the bolts again.

The problem is if the bolts stretched/loosened enough to leak, it may have burnt the gasket in the spot it leaked... It might not have too... It's worth a few minutes with a wrench to tighten them before taking them back off.

 

[Ross Wooldridge]

Agreed. Good advice from Big_John.

 

[Mick]

Glad you're home safely. Retorque the exhaust manifolds.

Front drums may need adjustment - they often pull on harder stops but seek OK around town...

Yes, will do on the exhaust. Yep, the brakes seemed fine on surface streets, like you said. Might go ahead and replace the lines up there as well.

 

[detmatt]

Check the condition of the rubber brake lines if you haven't already. If they're old they tend to swell shut constricting the flow.

 

[Mick]

No gaskets needed under the exhaust manifold. The factory never used them. It's not worth pulling them off at this point though.

You may get away with retorqing the bolts if the gasket hasn't blown out. The bolts heat and expand, cool and contract etc. after driving the car and they stretch. When I put exhaust manifolds on, I drive it a time or two and then tighten the bolts again.

The problem is if the bolts stretched/loosened enough to leak, it may have burnt the gasket in the spot it leaked... It might not have too... It's worth a few minutes with a wrench to tighten them before taking them back off.

I am hoping I can just get a wrench on it and be done with it. I hope that gasket is still good, too. If not, no worries. She's worth it. I will get pics up once I have cleaned her up a bit.

 

[Mick]

Check the condition of the rubber brake lines if you haven't already. If they're old they tend to swell shut constricting the flow.

I haven't yet, still punch drunk from the drive, but that's the first thing I will look at. Under normal driving, didn't notice anything.

 

[Duncan]

Is it just that my memory is faulty or[?] - but I seem to remember the old drum brakes were known for just that kind of behavior under hard/emergency braking. One of the things disc brakes improved upon, I thought.

 

[Ross Wooldridge]

Nope, you remember correctly. Essentially a less than ideal design for vehicles where servicing was only very periodic.

Typically, self adjusting drum brakes were anything but self adjusting... designed to self adjust when applying the brakes while backing up, the adjusters often were seized or stiff, resulting in brakes that were not evenly adjusted... result: one grips harder than the other, especially under hard stops.

I was told by the old grey beards way back when to manually adjust drums every month and to lube the adjusters too... adjust so that there was just the slightest drag on the wheel when rotating by hand.

Hence my car always pulled straight and true under all braking... but drums are hideous for other reasons (fade under repeated applications and lack of high speed stopping power) which are the primary reasons for discs. Plus the fact that people don't even know that shoes are supposed to be arced to fit the drums to maximize swept area...

 

[Duncan]

Yep, just as I remembered! :-D

The thought crossed my mind a few days ago that if we could have some of the cars of say the 60s, give or take a few years, with today's engineering, wouldn't they be nothing but even more awesome?

 

[cantflip]

Nope, you remember correctly. Essentially a less than ideal design for vehicles where servicing was only very periodic.

Typically, self adjusting drum brakes were anything but self adjusting... designed to self adjust when applying the brakes while backing up, the adjusters often were seized or stiff, resulting in brakes that were not evenly adjusted... result: one grips harder than the other, especially under hard stops.

I was told by the old grey beards way back when to manually adjust drums every month and to lube the adjusters too... adjust so that there was just the slightest drag on the wheel when rotating by hand.

Hence my car always pulled straight and true under all braking... but drums are hideous for other reasons (fade under repeated applications and lack of high speed stopping power) which are the primary reasons for discs. Plus the fact that people don't even know that shoes are supposed to be arced to fit the drums to maximize swept area...

Just to add to your list... if machined unequally or if the manufacture of the drums was different left to right, you could get hot pulling also. Bigger issue if cast iron and aluminum drums got mixed (for cars that had that possibility). You have this drum brake stuff down better than 99% of those currently repairing cars professionally.

 

[cantflip]

Got up yesterday morning at zero dark thirty on a flight out of Louisville with my awesome co-pilot Ginny, to Omaha, Nebraska. We got picked up from the airport by the gentleman (Don Peers) that did my pre-purchase inspection (for the credit union). Treated us like family and got us hooked up with the seller. We took him and his wife to lunch and saw a little bit of Omaha.
Okay, the car had been at a shop in York, Nebraska, getting looked over and agreed upon repairs made to Bess, pre-purchase. The a/c, (which had a new compressor, wasn't blowing cold and there was an exhaust leak at that exhaust butterfly/heat rise valve (is that what it's called?) These guys (Skip's in York) have a solid reputation, and after some discussion, decided that the valve just needed to go. Cool. They took both exhaust manifolds off, shaved them, and put gaskets on them. Refilled a/c, and try as they might, could find no leak. Good to go.
Got the car, quiet as could be and cold a/c. Get on the road, somewhere in Missouri I think, or was it Iowa? Anyway, a damn coyote (believe it or not) trots-not runs-across the interstate. Time to test those big beautiful power drum brakes. Bess tries to send me into a ditch. Right side grabbed; driver side not so much. Didn't notice this in drive around Omaha, and may have developed just then. Midway through Missouri, heard that unmistakable exhaust leak start up. Next gas stop, popped the hood and sure enough, another leak, this time from the driver side. Did they just not torque it down or what? I can also confirm she has original headlights...Anyway, made it home in one piece and and look forward to working on her.

A belated and I'm glad you made it home safe as well. Pictures will be required by the membership.

 

[Ross Wooldridge]

Just to add to your list... if machined unequally or if the manufacture of the drums was different left to right, you could get hot pulling also. Bigger issue if cast iron and aluminum drums got mixed (for cars that had that possibility). You have this drum brake stuff down better than 99% of those currently repairing cars professionally.

Thanks for the vote of confidence... I find what you mention very interesting... machining differences I can see cropping up in efforts to save money resulting in issues, but mixing aluminum and cast iron drums?!? Oy!

 

[Mick]

A belated and I'm glad you made it home safe as well. Pictures will be required by the membership.

Thank you! Meet "Bess":

 

[Ross Wooldridge]

Lovely! Congratulations!

 

[cantflip]

Thank you! Meet "Bess":

Gorgeous! You found the right place for a sweetheart like that.

 

[Zymurgy]

Great looking car congratulations. Enjoy!

 

[detmatt]

She's a real beauty, well done!

 

[Samplingman]

Holy Hanna, that's beautiful! Wow, great catch, and welcome! Does she have pore event windows, by any chance?