Queer car

[Blish]

I'm trying to figure out whats wrong with my car. Had a slight bogging today but had to drive it. Stalled it pulling out onna road. Cranked it up, gave it 1500 rpm, dropped it into drive... she didn't like that. I have a feeling I simultaneously broke everything all together. The rear end "skips" or feels like its jumping teeth while turning and taking off under anything over slow acceleration, drive doesn't work, 2 doesn't either, but 1 does, and 2 and D do after you get some speed (which takes for ever btw) And something under the front of the car that sounded like a flywheel or brake rotor being turned (high pitched metal on metal clearencing sound) decided to happen. It quit after 5-10 minutes. Car drove onto a trailer but was hell in the process.

What did I do to the car? How expensive will this be?

-Paul

 

[Davea Lux]

Sounds like you you will need to completely rebuild the transmission. Dropping a transmission into gear at high RPMs can do a lot of damage. Learn from this adventure. A full rebuild at a quality shop will start at about $1600 and can go as high as $2500 or more depending on how much is broken. If the case is trashed, you will also need a core transmission. Given that you could hear metal on metal, there is also going to be a bunch of metal shavings inside the transmission. Transmission shop will probably want to disassemble the transmission prior to giving you a rebuild quote. Depending on how much you drive this car a cheaper alternative might be to source a wrecking yard transmission. Same is also true of the rear end assuming that it is also broken. I doubt that it is unless it was at the point of failure on the neutral drop.

Dave

 

[Blish]

Sounds like you you will need to completely rebuild the transmission. Dropping a transmission into gear at high RPMs can do a lot of damage. Learn from this adventure. A full rebuild at a quality shop will start at about $1600 and can go as high as $2500 or more depending on how much is broken. If the case is trashed, you will also need a core transmission. Given that you could hear metal on metal, there is also going to be a bunch of metal shavings inside the transmission. Transmission shop will probably want to disassemble the transmission prior to giving you a rebuild quote. Depending on how much you drive this car a cheaper alternative might be to source a wrecking yard transmission. Sane is also true of the rear end assuming that it is also broken. I doubt that it is unless it was at the point of failure on the neutral drop.

Dave

The rear end is definitely making alot of noises. Also I barely have $300 to my name

 

[Davea Lux]

The rear end is definitely making alot of noises. Also I barely have $300 to my name

Find yourself a parts car.

Dave

 

[LeBaron1973]

There's an old saying - Act in haste, repent at leisure.

Save up and do it right, at least the car is OK, not wrecked, all the best with her when funds allow the proper repairs.

 

[75LandYacht]

Had similar issues with my 77. Wouldn’t go into gear right away after putting her in D or R. While in gear, give her a rev and she’s move. Thought it was tranny, had it rebuilt to the tune of $1600. Turns out it was / is the carrier in the rear and is going bad. With the car in gear the driveshaft turns but the wheels don’t until some rev is added.. crazy right!, I sourced another axle from Murray for $350.. spring install project.

Your issues some compounded. Could be One or both.. keep us posted.

 

[CBODY67]

By observation, a parts car CAN be a good idea, in general. Provided you can store it in such a manner as to keep any municipality operatives in Code Compliance at bay in the process. Much less any HOA operatives, if applicable.

The other consideration is to get the same model year as you have, so that you don't encounter any changes from one model year to the next. Chasing additional hook-up parts can be an expensive (time and money) bummer, too. This might work better for the rear axle (if needed) than the trans, possibly. Do NOT presume that "they're all the same", although they might be. And then there's "the search" for a vehicle which was not a generally high volume seller, back then. The "joys" of owning/driving something different as an only car, unfortunately.

In some respects, I HOPE what you were feeling was a "judder" from the trans frictions not working smoothly. At least the Low-Reverse band is still working decently well (why it can move in "1" but not "D" or "2"). That modest-rpm "neutral drop" would be the same a popping the clutch on a manual trans car at the same rpm, by comparison. Normally, those activities are "surviveable", but if things are worn and on the verge of failure, they get there sooner, by observation.

It might be an option to "cheap-out" the trans rebuild, but with that much failure, building a good core trans might be better. Which is where the quality trans shop comes into play. No need to make it a bang-shifter, but keeping and enhancing the factory quick/firm shift orientations in the process can work well.

I believe that many in here have been in similar "When it rains, it pours" situations. Somehow, we all got through them and lived to tell about them. You can too. Whether it's vehicle issues, family issues, housing, or whatever issues. Let your "engine rpm and oil pressure" come back to normal and formulate a plan that is executable and then move in that direction. "Good choices" can be important. Best of luck!

Take care and please keep us posted on your progress,
CBODY67

 

[Blish]

Find yourself a parts car.

Dave

Will try but thata not too easy. Down here there isn't exactly any gold Mines of mopars around here.

U actually considered parting the car out and buying a 83 imperial I know of, keeping the wheels, tires, and motor, and swapping the 400 into it.

The body is good and the paint is good about the same or better condition as my newport, the guy wants $800 for the whole car. It ran 3 years ago but I dont trust a 318 EFI.

I could also go find my dream car and stick the motor in that, a 72 plymouth fury gran sedan. Unsure yet. The "fix my car" route sounds super expensive compared to selling it for parts

 

[Blish]

There's an old saying - Act in haste, repent at leisure.

Save up and do it right, at least the car is OK, not wrecked, all the best with her when funds allow the proper repairs.

Yes, I have definitely learned the hard way. Fortunately I have a number of old Ford pickups to drive still

 

[Blish]

Had similar issues with my 77. Wouldn’t go into gear right away after putting her in D or R. While in gear, give her a rev and she’s move. Thought it was tranny, had it rebuilt to the tune of $1600. Turns out it was / is the carrier in the rear and is going bad. With the car in gear the driveshaft turns but the wheels don’t until some rev is added.. crazy right!, I sourced another axle from Murray for $350.. spring install project.

Your issues some compounded. Could be One or both.. keep us posted.

This is what I'm hoping and that I can just save up and stick a rear end in it!

Or go the budget upgrade route and swap a 9 1/4 in. That will never die!

Or considering getting another car, still thinking though

 

[Big_John]

IMHO, 1500 RPM neutral drop won't cause that much damage. That's really just over a high idle. Seen much worse done on a regular basis without that type of carnage.

But, the damage is done and now you learn from it.

Figuring this car has an 8 1/4 rear, you can pull the rear cover and take a look at it and see what's broken. Do that first.

The trans isn't so easy. If you did break it, chances are whatever you broke took out the case too. Dropping the pan might not show you much though.

The 400 isn't an easy swap into that Imperial. In fact it would be a huge project that I would try to discourage you from trying.

I admit I would have a hard time passing it up, but I'd stay with a small block in that Imperial.

 

[Blish]

By observation, a parts car CAN be a good idea, in general. Provided you can store it in such a manner as to keep any municipality operatives in Code Compliance at bay in the process. Much less any HOA operatives, if applicable.

The other consideration is to get the same model year as you have, so that you don't encounter any changes from one model year to the next. Chasing additional hook-up parts can be an expensive (time and money) bummer, too. This might work better for the rear axle (if needed) than the trans, possibly. Do NOT presume that "they're all the same", although they might be. And then there's "the search" for a vehicle which was not a generally high volume seller, back then. The "joys" of owning/driving something different as an only car, unfortunately.

In some respects, I HOPE what you were feeling was a "judder" from the trans frictions not working smoothly. At least the Low-Reverse band is still working decently well (why it can move in "1" but not "D" or "2"). That modest-rpm "neutral drop" would be the same a popping the clutch on a manual trans car at the same rpm, by comparison. Normally, those activities are "surviveable", but if things are worn and on the verge of failure, they get there sooner, by observation.

It might be an option to "cheap-out" the trans rebuild, but with that much failure, building a good core trans might be better. Which is where the quality trans shop comes into play. No need to make it a bang-shifter, but keeping and enhancing the factory quick/firm shift orientations in the process can work well.

I believe that many in here have been in similar "When it rains, it pours" situations. Somehow, we all got through them and lived to tell about them. You can too. Whether it's vehicle issues, family issues, housing, or whatever issues. Let your "engine rpm and oil pressure" come back to normal and formulate a plan that is executable and then move in that direction. "Good choices" can be important. Best of luck!

Take care and please keep us posted on your progress,
CBODY67

I live in the middle of nowhere with my own land, so fortunately there is no HOA or city ordinances to worry about. Its hillbilly heck out here haha. I do understand that circumstances and limitations are different with other people. I do feel like anything 74-78 would work right up with my 77 but you're right I need to sit and compare parts before I buy if I buy used parts.

I'm crossing my fingers its the rear end.

 

[Blish]

IMHO, 1500 RPM neutral drop won't cause that much damage. That's really just over a high idle. Seen much worse done on a regular basis without that type of carnage.

But, the damage is done and now you learn from it.

Figuring this car has an 8 1/4 rear, you can pull the rear cover and take a look at it and see what's broken. Do that first.

The trans isn't so easy. If you did break it, chances are whatever you broke took out the case too. Dropping the pan might not show you much though.

The 400 isn't an easy swap into that Imperial. In fact it would be a huge project that I would try to discourage you from trying.

I admit I would have a hard time passing it up, but I'd stay with a small block in that Imperial.

Yeah looking into it thats a terrible amount of work, having to pull all that electronic wiring vacuum bs and replace it with new parts that don't exist aren't exactly handy. Its more time then its worth.

Could slap the 400 in a old dodge truck, keep the newport around and swap the 8.0 V10 in like I was wanting to do a month or two ago

 

[MONC440]

If the trans moves in Manual 1st but not drive 1st then you probably broke the one way roller clutch in the back of the case. In manual 1st the low reverse band is applied, in drive 1st only the one way roller clutch holds.

BTW a V10 will fit in a C-body but you got to have some fabrication skills and some cash. I have about $600 into my swap now, not including the engine and trans, and still need a driveshaft and exhaust. Good luck. If you do it start a build tread like mine below.
1970 Plymouth Sport Fury V10 Swap Build Thread

 

[bluefury361]

No one has mentioned the trans filter. A clogged filter will cause some issues like you mention. It's a cheap and easy fix.
Won't do anything for a rear end problem though.

 

[Blish]

If the trans moves in Manual 1st but not drive 1st then you probably broke the one way roller clutch in the back of the case. In manual 1st the low reverse band is applied, in drive 1st only the one way roller clutch holds.

BTW a V10 will fit in a C-body but you got to have some fabrication skills and some cash. I have about $600 into my swap now, not including the engine and trans, and still need a driveshaft and exhaust. Good luck. If you do it start a build tread like mine below.
1970 Plymouth Sport Fury V10 Swap Build Thread

I can definitely save up a couple thousand and cram a v10 in there!

 

[Blish]

No one has mentioned the trans filter. A clogged filter will cause some issues like you mention. It's a cheap and easy fix.
Won't do anything for a rear end problem though.

I feel like since the trans problem started around the same time the car started singing the USSR anthem and doing communist things, that the filter is likely not a problem

But I haven't checked it so im going to start with rebuilding the rear as I feel it will be the easiest to rebuild, then see how she rolls.

 

[70bigblockdodge]

Wow, I would take that Imp for 800. I would guess the rear is broken in car. If the trans died that easy it was bad to begin with.

 

[CBODY67]

Doesn't the Chry V10 have the LA bellhousing bolt pattern on the block, since that's the basic architecture it was expanded from?

A stroker 408 LA motor would fit better in the Imperial, with a modern self-learn EFI on it, too. Or even a salvage yard 360 EFI motor, for that matter. Most of the Imperial's EFI is in on the air cleaner base "plate", as I recall. If it's running flakily, it might just need the band clamp on the air cleaner secured with NO air leaks around the edge of the air cleaner . . . as simple as that might sound, the MAF is in the air cleaner snorkle. Remove the air cleaner top with the engine running, loss of air flow signal kills the engine.

Just some thoughts,
CBODY67

 

[CBODY67]

Wow, I would take that Imp for 800. I would guess the rear is broken in car. If the trans died that easy it was bad to begin with.

Make the trans a non-lock-up converter unit. I've put two torque converters in my '80 Newport 360 2bbl as the heat treat on the splines was not good or went away, with the lock-up converters.