Spark Plug question

[mopar Joe 65]

I have a 68 383 4bl. 906 heads don't know what it come out of but i ordered a set of champion plugs for it and found out they are the long reach plugs and mine are the short reach autolite 85 . My question is why do some 383's use short and some use the long ones ? I don't think i can use the long ones they look like they would hit the piston ? Anyone know what the deal is ?

 

[CBODY67]

To my knowledge, there were no long-reach B/RB spark plugs for the 906 heads, or any other B/RB cylinder heads.

The hi-perf/police B/RB Chrysler Corp. 350, 361, 383, 400, 413, 426 Street WEDGE, and 440s usually had J-10Y Champions as their stock spark plugs. Normal 4bbl engines could range a bit warmer into J-11 or J-12YY territory, with the 383 2bbls being Champion J-14Ys.

Champion, as other USA brand spark plugs, had heat range numbers where the lower numbers were on the "cold" end of the spectrum and the higher numbers were "warmer". This relates to the speed with which the plug insulator dissipates heat to the cylinder head and coolant. NGKs go backward/opposite to that, as some other import brand plugs might.

The long-reach plugs were on the LA motors. 318, 340, and 360. Some of the aftermarket B/RB aluminum cylinder heads could also use long-reach plugs. Not sure what the 426 HEMI engines, too, but it could well be a long-reach plug, too.

Go into the Autolite website and look for their online catalog, plus check their "cross-over" to other brands of plugs and heat ranges. Then do the same for Champion, seeing what crosses they have for the J-10Y, J-12Y, and J-14Y plugs. Then return the incorrect ones you got to RA.

The prior OEM J-12Y (for example) Champions might not be available any more, but a copper-core variant might be. In the case of J-12Ys, it could well be J-12YC?

CBODY67

 

[traintech55]

This seems to be a new nightmare problem for old cars. Most people in the business today have no idea how cars were built 50 years ago. I have had to tell off a few of the newer people when they come back to me and say something is impossible. I love to come back with the line, "I was turning wrenches on these cars before you were a gleam in your daddy's eyes".

 

[Big_John]

This seems to be a new nightmare problem for old cars.

One of the big problems is the parts listings may not be right. The biggest offender, and noted many times here, is eBay listings. It's a nightmare to someone that's not familiar with old cars and parts. Places like Auto Zone etc. are usually better, but even then, it's not 100%. Rock Auto can be good, but they drop the ball sometimes. My experience with NAPA has been very good, but no matter what you do, you have to be as informed as possible when ordering parts.

Lately, I've been sourcing parts at Amazon... but I only search and buy when I have good parts numbers. Amazon's listings are awful, as bad as eBay, but if you have the part number, you can have the part at your door (with Amazon Prime) in two days... Often quicker and cheaper than the local guys can do. Rock Auto is usually a good source for part numbers. Amazon also has an amazing return policy.

Download a parts manual and service manual here: MyMopar - Mopar Forums & Information - MyMopar Tools/Reference Factory part numbers will help sometimes and often I will compare part numbers between models and years to figure out what I can use. It's really needed if you buy NOS parts as those vendors are often wrong too.

BTW, I always open boxes at the counter.... I've had wrong parts in swapped boxes and even used parts in new boxes.

 

[commando1]

Since he mentioned that they are Autolite and they are the shorties, Im willing to bet he got the 14mm tapered seat plugs for the MH heads. AMHIK

 

[68 4spd Fury]

For what it's worth, I had good luck with NGK (3332) XR5 on my 383 HP. On any application really, I know they are import but resisted fowling and outlasted the champions.

 

[mopar Joe 65]

Thanks guys for all the info, i returned the 3405 champions at a cost of $7.20 I think those were for a small block ? Anyway i went to autozone and bought a set of autolite # 85 for $19.00 . Here is the strange part , they give me 2 boxes with 4 plugs in a box one box are silver with the crush washer attached and the other box are black steel with the washer in the box. Both boxes are the same with the number 85 on them, he said the plugs are the same ? I told him i don't care i want all silver so he exchanged the other 4 . Here is a picture of the box, i don't have one of the other box but the picture on it is black without the washer ?

 

[70bigblockdodge]

NGK.

 

[CBODY67]

An observed issue with NGK is that there are TWO numbers for ONE plug. The plug as an individual unit AND then as 4 plugs/box. So, you have to be careful about that, sometimes.

Used to be that all spark plugs were packaged in boxes of 8. If you needed one, you pulled one out of that box, leaving 7 behind. Good people would check the quantity before selling you that box! With the increased popularity of 4 cyl vehicles, easier to package them in boxes of 4 so there are more "full boxes" on the shelves.

When I found RockAuto, I'd use it as catalog reference. Eventually did buy some NGKs from them a few years ago. As many of the other part websites might only go back unto 1984 (as many OEM-related parts websites now do), RA at least has model year listings back into the "early days". But, sometimes, you'll need to hit the part manufacturer's website for verification or further research.

The issue of the "person behind the counter" at the auto supplies really knowing what they're looking at OR know what you're looking for is NOT new NOR just of recent history. In the middle '70s, I wanted to get a "timing tape" to put on our '66 Newport to use a timing light to check the advance curve of the distributor. I went into an auto supply which allegedly had sold some hot rod parts in the then-recent past. I walked in, the young guy greeted me and asked what I wanted. I told him "timing tape" for a '66 Chrysler 383. He brought back a timing chain in a box. I explained what the part was, he went to the back, asked somebody, and came back with "unless it's on the Mr. Gasket j-hook parts area, we don't have it." I went over and found only Chevy items, thanked him, and left. Those issues CAN also happen at dealerships, too!

Do your homework, shop on their website, then go in to purchase it, if the locals have it. But then I have a bad tendency to "over-shop" things prior to a purchase.

CBODY67

 

[mopar Joe 65]

Yea i know iam older than dirt but i realy feel it when i go to a part store nowdays, things have changed alot over the years. When i used to work in the part stores people would buy kits to rebuild your fuel pump now you just through it away and buy a new one. We used to sell spark plugs for about a buck a piece people would tell me they can get them at kmart for 89 cents and i would tell them go for it thats where i get mine. If you want something for a 60's car now its like shopping for a model T.

 

[traintech55]

If you want something for a 60's car now its like shopping for a model T.

Hell today you can get parts easier for a model T.

 

[CBODY67]

Hell today you can get parts easier for a model T.

. . . . IF you know where to look. There are probably MORE parts available now for the '30s Fords, including hot rod engine parts. Seems like there are THREE different people doing body parts? The new-casting Model T engine blocks are better than the orig ones, from what I've read. "Follow the money" . . . and related car values.

I'm not inclined to pay $30K for an over-restored 1952 Chevy 1/2 ton pickup, but people are doing it AND there are repro cabs for them, plus frame kits, and such.

CBODY67

 

[ayilar]

Reviving this thread to ask for advice. For Medina, my '71 T-code Monaco, I got Champion Copper Plus 14 ("fits 66-78 RB 440"). For the '73 T-code NYB that I just acquired, Summit suggests, as well as the 14, the Copper Plus 63 ("fits 71-74 RB 440").

AFAICT, there are two differences:

1. the CP14's have a .375" reach while the CP63 have a .38" reach;
2. The CP14's are RJ12YC, whereas the CP63 are RJ14YC.

The Champion website recommends both as appropriate for a '73 NYer. Any reason why I should go for one rather than the other? @CBODY67 -- I read your comments here re: preferring resistor to non-resistor, and about J-10Y v. J-12Y v. J-13Y v. J-14Y. Further thoughts?

 

[Polara_500]

RJ12's are a wee bit cooler and were typically spec'd for a 4 barrel engine while the RJ14's were used on 2 barrel setups.

 

[bluefury361]

I never use anything but original OEM Champions in Mopar engines. Original old stock champ plugs show up on ebay pretty regular in the popular sizes. A bit more costly usually but they are the right ones. I keep a stock of J-10Y, J-11Y and J-12Y plugs on the shelf.

 

[ayilar]

Thank you all. I ended up buying a set of eight Champion spark plugs (specifically the Copper Plus 14 from Summit) for Ming, my '73 NYB.

 

[Gerald Morris]

To my knowledge, there were no long-reach B/RB spark plugs for the 906 heads, or any other B/RB cylinder heads.

The hi-perf/police B/RB Chrysler Corp. 350, 361, 383, 400, 413, 426 Street WEDGE, and 440s usually had J-10Y Champions as their stock spark plugs. Normal 4bbl engines could range a bit warmer into J-11 or J-12YY territory, with the 383 2bbls being Champion J-14Ys.

....

The prior OEM J-12Y (for example) Champions might not be available any more, but a copper-core variant might be. In the case of J-12Ys, it could well be J-12YC?

CBODY67

The J-12YCs are just what I run with my 383, and I've yet to experience anything better for it. Found a SU-PERB octogenarian carburetor specialist to build one of my Strombergs for me, and now that motor can pass the old "sideways dime on the radiator cap" test which once played as a T'V; commercial ad..... in the LongAgo.

 

[Gerald Morris]

I never use anything but original OEM Champions in Mopar engines. Original old stock champ plugs show up on ebay pretty regular in the popular sizes. A bit more costly usually but they are the right ones. I keep a stock of J-10Y, J-11Y and J-12Y plugs on the shelf.

I've been pondering the merits of this for my purposes. Is the difference worth it? I KNOW the NOS plugs can be had for a relatively modest markup, considering.

 

[ayilar]

On the advice of this thread, I just bought Champion Copper Plus J12YC for Regina, my L-code 1970 Polara 'vert (383-2).

I also need plugs for Poppy, my 1970 Polara 'vert. Summit has the copper 3405 and a platinum one for twice the price:

1970 DODGE POLARA Champion Spark Plugs Spark Plugs - 0.750 in. Spark Plug Reach (in.) - In Stock Filter Options Parts & Accessories | Summit Racing

Any thoughts? Paging @CBODY67 @Big_John in particular as they have contributed to this thread.

 

[Gerald Morris]

On the advice of this thread, I just bought Champion Copper Plus J12YC for Regina, my L-code 1970 Polara 'vert (383-2).

I also need plugs for Poppy, my 1970 Polara 'vert. Summit has the copper 3405 and a platinum one for twice the price:

1970 DODGE POLARA Champion Spark Plugs Spark Plugs - 0.750 in. Spark Plug Reach (in.) - In Stock Filter Options Parts & Accessories | Summit Racing

Any thoughts? Paging @CBODY67 @Big_John in particular as they have contributed to this thread.

See if you can score some NOS Champion J14Ys for 2 bbl 383s, those do well. I run NOS Bosch platinum plugs during the summer now, after putting the Edelbrock Performer 1405 on, to keep in accord with the FSM call for a cooler Champion (J11Y I think) for 4bbl running. A solid contingent of NGK enthusiasts swears by them for as the BEST modern plug, and they may well be right, but I've not yet tested any, having horded plenty of the old J14Ys and the Bosch plugs. Good luck in your search if you want the good old stuff!