Terrible Start Up Sound and Oil Issues-Advice Needed (77 440 NYB)

77newyorker440

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Good Evening Guys,
Since I have owned the car (June 26th, 2020), my 1977 Chrysler New Yorker has had many issues, however, two have persisted through my entire ownership.
1. As you can hear in the YouTube videos linked below when I start up the car, it has this horrible squealing noise. This noise can also be heard when the car is held at a high RPM (By ear I would guess about 3500. I have tried tightening and loosening the belts. The only time this noise went away was when I adjusted the power steering/water pump a couple of months ago. When no belts are on the engine, it makes no noises, so it isn't an internal issue. The accessories that have been replaced are the alternator and the water pump. Does anyone have any suggestions?

P.S. If you are wondering, this is what the car sounds like with the stock exhaust manifolds and catalytic converter but without the rest of the exhaust (It rusted off). New exhaust video with new pipes and headers will be coming soon.

2. Everytime I park the car, it leaks oil. It does not seem to leak while running or while sitting and idling, but it leaks when parked after a drive. For a while, I thought it was the valve cover gaskets, but those are replaced and definitely not leaking (no smoke under the hood), but there is still oil on the ground. The oil puddles under the bell housing, but I am not sure if that would indicate a rear main seal cause that is the lowest point on the engine/trans so I feel like all oil would drip down there. It has lost a quart of oil in the last month and a half. Any ideas?

Thanks,
77newyorker440
Video:
 

69PHOENIX

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G'Day,
Not Saying this is the Answer But Many Years ago I had a 69 Phoenix 383 with a Similar Problem, was getting all set to Pull the Motor when a Friend with a Lot more Mopar Experience asked me if I had checked the Oil Pressure Switch.
Mounted at the very back of the Motor in a Position where, if it leaked, the Oil ran down & Pooled under the Bell housing.
You may Imagine the Sigh of Relief when that's what it turned out to be.
Regards the Fan belts have you tried a Little Soap just to see if that Quietens the Noise.
Start with the Belt you think is the Problem & keep going till you find the Little Bugger doing all the Complaining.
Just a LITTLE Soap! (Cake Type, NOT Liquid or Powder.)
I have a Little Mazda 626 that Once in a While Upon Start up Sounds like you're standing on the Cat's Tail.
Frightens the Hell out of the Neighbours. LOL
For Some Reason the A/C Belts get "Sticky" once in a While.
Regards Tony.M
P.S.
Damn I thought you were Talking about a Loud Noise!
That small Squeal you here on Start Up is Totally Normal to Me. LOL
 
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Big_John

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1. As you can hear in the YouTube videos linked below when I start up the car, it has this horrible squealing noise. This noise can also be heard when the car is held at a high RPM (By ear I would guess about 3500. I have tried tightening and loosening the belts. The only time this noise went away was when I adjusted the power steering/water pump a couple of months ago. When no belts are on the engine, it makes no noises, so it isn't an internal issue. The accessories that have been replaced are the alternator and the water pump. Does anyone have any suggestions?

First question, was the sound happening before you replaced the alternator and water pump?
Second question, since you have separate belts for the alternator and steering pump, have you tried just taking belts off one at a time? That will isolate where the problem is.

2. Everytime I park the car, it leaks oil. It does not seem to leak while running or while sitting and idling, but it leaks when parked after a drive. For a while, I thought it was the valve cover gaskets, but those are replaced and definitely not leaking (no smoke under the hood), but there is still oil on the ground. The oil puddles under the bell housing, but I am not sure if that would indicate a rear main seal cause that is the lowest point on the engine/trans so I feel like all oil would drip down there. It has lost a quart of oil in the last month and a half. Any ideas?

First thing to look at is the oil pressure sender. They often leak, drip down the bellhousing and mimic a rear seal problem.
 

Imperial dude

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I agree it isn't a horrible squeal (should hear some of the ones I've had) but can be annoying
You didn't say, have you replaced the belts?
Sometimes old belts get hard, glazed, cracked, like any other rubber part
And if you have any double pulleys, from my understanding you have to get a set of"matched" belts, just going in and buying 2 size xxx belts isn't good enough, you have to buy a pair, if I'm mistaken I'm sure someone will chime in
I agree with Phoenix, use soap and find the culprit and I suggest changing the offending belt,if you haven't already
 

69PHOENIX

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Oh By The Way,
If You Think That's a Problem.
We had the Six Cyl Hemi's here in Australia, They were a Brilliant Motor, Powerful & with 28 M.P.G Freeway Cruising, But they had a Problem with Valve Stem Seals.
When they got a Little Worn or Hardened you could clear the Entire Street on Start Up.
It was REALLY Embarrassing. ( The Cloud of Smoke was Incredible)
Many a Car was Sold because it Needed a Motor when it really only needed the Valve Stem Seals Replaced.
Regards, Tony.M
 

77newyorker440

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First question, was the sound happening before you replaced the alternator and water pump?
Second question, since you have separate belts for the alternator and steering pump, have you tried just taking belts off one at a time? That will isolate where the problem is.



First thing to look at is the oil pressure sender. They often leak, drip down the bellhousing and mimic a rear seal problem.
Yep, I checked the first ever video I took of this car and it had the noise in it. I tried taking the belts off individually a couple of months back, which made me think that it was the power steering/water pump belt. However, I am not sure if that diagnosis is correct. BTW, the sound seemed to go away for most of the winter (Don't know what that signifies).
Also, I will look into the oil pressure sender, which is a huge relief, as I did not really want to pull the engine.
Thanks,
77newyorker440
 

CBODY67

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When the cars were new, matched belts for the a/c and alternator was what was sold. "Matched" in that they came from the same batch AND in the same packaging sleeve, with appropriate production codes on them. I suspect that all you'll find now are singles? But singles with the same codes can constitute "matched", possibly.

Look for the newest date codes on the belts to ensure they are fresh, rather than "shelf-aged". Which might be a trick at this point in time. So getting them from a higher-volume seller can be important, as their stock would have been replenished more recently than not.

Usually, Chryslers didn't have the same issues with squeaking belts that GM cars tended to have, by observation. Without having them adjusted tight enough to play a tune on.

Enjoy!
CBODY67
 

77newyorker440

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I agree it isn't a horrible squeal (should hear some of the ones I've had) but can be annoying
You didn't say, have you replaced the belts?
Sometimes old belts get hard, glazed, cracked, like any other rubber part
And if you have any double pulleys, from my understanding you have to get a set of"matched" belts, just going in and buying 2 size xxx belts isn't good enough, you have to buy a pair, if I'm mistaken I'm sure someone will chime in
I agree with Phoenix, use soap and find the culprit and I suggest changing the offending belt,if you haven't already
The two AC/Alternator belts have been replaced but the Power Steering/Water Pump belt was left because it stopped making noise and I didn't want to mess ith it.
 

Pertti K

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Is the thermostatic fan clutch OK? Turns freely when cold? I had a fan belt squeak issue on my Olds Starfire, mainly when the rpm was high or changed rapidly. Replacing the sticking fan clutch solved it.
 

thethee

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I was watching your video and kept thinking "okay so when is this terrible noise coming?" but then the video was over. They weren't Mopars but I've been around some cars that had it waaaay worse than this, like squaling for the first two blocks or something thereof. There have been plenty suggestions already, but I wouldn't sweat it this is all it is.

For the oil leak, have you checked if the top of the bell housing is wet? Could be the oil pressure sending unit on the back of the engine that drips down and mimic a rear main seal leak.

BTW, I like the way she sounds with just the manifolds and cats, I understand why you wouldn't want to change that.
 

Big_John

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The two AC/Alternator belts have been replaced but the Power Steering/Water Pump belt was left because it stopped making noise and I didn't want to mess ith it.

Everything you've said and the noise leads us to the power steering belt slipping a little on start up.

It's always been my practice to replace ALL the belts rather than replacing one or two belts at a time, figuring that rubber ages and the belts wear at about the same rate and if one belt is bad, the others aren't far behind. The old belts go in the tool box in the trunk.

So, you have a couple choices. Either live with it like suggested or change the belt.
 

mikedrini

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Oh By The Way,
If You Think That's a Problem.
We had the Six Cyl Hemi's here in Australia, They were a Brilliant Motor, Powerful & with 28 M.P.G Freeway Cruising, But they had a Problem with Valve Stem Seals.
When they got a Little Worn or Hardened you could clear the Entire Street on Start Up.
It was REALLY Embarrassing. ( The Cloud of Smoke was Incredible)
Many a Car was Sold because it Needed a Motor when it really only needed the Valve Stem Seals Replaced.
Regards, Tony.M

:rofl:
 

77newyorker440

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Thank you all for the responses!
Quick question? Do I use sealant on the threads for the oil pressure switch? The threads already seem to have a dry orange coating on them.
Thanks,
77newyorker440
 

RagTop66

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Good Evening Guys,
Since I have owned the car (June 26th, 2020), my 1977 Chrysler New Yorker has had many issues, however, two have persisted through my entire ownership.
1. As you can hear in the YouTube videos linked below when I start up the car, it has this horrible squealing noise. This noise can also be heard when the car is held at a high RPM (By ear I would guess about 3500. I have tried tightening and loosening the belts. The only time this noise went away was when I adjusted the power steering/water pump a couple of months ago. When no belts are on the engine, it makes no noises, so it isn't an internal issue. The accessories that have been replaced are the alternator and the water pump. Does anyone have any suggestions?

P.S. If you are wondering, this is what the car sounds like with the stock exhaust manifolds and catalytic converter but without the rest of the exhaust (It rusted off). New exhaust video with new pipes and headers will be coming soon.

2. Everytime I park the car, it leaks oil. It does not seem to leak while running or while sitting and idling, but it leaks when parked after a drive. For a while, I thought it was the valve cover gaskets, but those are replaced and definitely not leaking (no smoke under the hood), but there is still oil on the ground. The oil puddles under the bell housing, but I am not sure if that would indicate a rear main seal cause that is the lowest point on the engine/trans so I feel like all oil would drip down there. It has lost a quart of oil in the last month and a half. Any ideas?

Thanks,
77newyorker440
Video:

I totally agree with the oil pressure sending unit leak. I had rebuilt my 440 and needed to replace the rear main housing. I went with a billet one. I was leaking oil and it looked like my leak was coming from the back of the motor. I was pretty happy to find that it was not the rear main, but the oil pressure sending unit (located on the rear top of the motor).
 

CBODY67

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Always look for the easiest and most probably source of oil leaks, rather than going to the "big ticket" items. Oil pressure sending units are higher-mileage possibilities, although the modern globally-produced items might be a bit less higher-mileage possibilities in modern times. Even so, I would suspect they might be more like 50Kmile items rather than 80+K items as when the cars were "used cars" originally.

Whether they run a gauge or an indicator light, there is a rubber diaphram in them that will wear with time and use.

Cleanup with some careful application of spray brake cleaner can be good and less involved than a "car wash" approach, as desired.

Enjoy!
CBODY67
 

77newyorker440

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Good news everyone!
The oil leak has gone away with the installation of a new oil pressure switch. Thank you all for the help!
Thanks,
77newyorker440
Okay, I may have spoken a bit too early. The bell housing is wet with oil once again, I think it may be the valve covers. Do you guys have a problem with the valve cover bolts coming loose over and over again? I will likely put in some Loctite next time I take them off.
 

CBODY67

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You might check the valve cover sealing edges for straightness and flatness around the bolt holes, for good measure. Do NOT crank down on them. Spray everything down with spray brake cleaner and watch it to see where the oil is coming from.

CBODY67
 

Big_John

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I will likely put in some Loctite next time I take them off.

Bad idea. Good way to break the small bolts off in the head.

If the valve covers are getting loose and leaking, either there's a problem with the covers or the gaskets are failing or both. Check for straightness and replace the gaskets. I prefer cork, but many like the silicone versions.
 
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