The best engine and trans rebuilt kit for 69 Imperial

marnaw

New Member
Joined
Jun 18, 2022
Messages
23
Reaction score
13
Location
Poland
Hi Folks.What’s the best engine and trans rebuilt kit for 69 Imperial? And where to buy one?Thx
 
What mileage and how long has it been not running (as applicable). What is the perceived desired ultimate result?

Kit? Are you wamting gaskets, seals, bearings, rings, pistons, timing chains, etc? Particular brands of these various components? Several things will be in "engine set", as rings, pistons, bearings. Gaskets will usually be in which area of the engine you are working on, which means three different gaskets sets to overhaul an engine, although some brands might have a "master overhaul set" which has everything.

One other issue is that certain items will have wear which will probably need to be machined away, to a slightly different size than original, AFTER which you can order the new parts (i.e., bearings, pistons) for these specific areas. There might be some generalities, but no "normal replacement size" to not do the machine work.

So, due to the various oversize/undersize machining operations, no generic "kit" per se, other than in the gasketing/sealing area, that I know of. Perhaps there might be, though?

Seems like, decades ago, Sealed Power used to do mix 'n match kits? Pistons of a particular type and oversize, rings to match, crank and rod bearings of a particular size (after the crank had been "worked"), plus a particular overhaul gasket set. But due to the number of variatons and age/sales of the engines that stuff was for, I somewhat doubt ALL of those earlier options might be available currently.

The OTHER thing is that many machine shops like to order the parts themselves. Not specifically so they make more money, but then THEY are in control of the sourcing of the items. That also means that if something comes in wrong or damaged, THEY are in control of getting what they need instead. Which means that related downtime can be minimized. Which means that they are not waiting on somebody else to call and get the parts needed. Some can be comfortable with the customer sourcing parts, but many are not as that "waiting for the correct parts" item is taking up space in their shop . . . space which should be making money. A variable situation.

There seems to be a quite large group of Mopar C-body people in Germany. Perhaps networking with them might be of benefit, considering your location? Some of their members have posted pictures/videos of their get-togethers over the past few years, in threads here.

Hope this might help,

CBODY67
 
Last edited:
In some respects, going for "the best" can be severe overkill and add more expense. I know, we all want "the best" for our cars, but in reality, OEM-spec might be plenty fine for our purposes. Just because a magazine article mentions a particular brand does not mean it might be better than OEM-spec, by observation. Sometimes, it might be bad, depending upon what it is, by observation.

So, after realizing this ages ago, my recommendations became "at least OEM-spec or better" rather than "the best". Now, there are some items where "the best" is better than OEM, as in Cloyes Timing Chain sets, for example. Or Fel-Pro gaskets, rather than OEM-spec, as that brand (and possibly others) now sell gaskets which far exceed what OEM-spec used to be, back then. Silvolite cast pistons are at least OEM-spec, but more reasonably-priced than some other brands . . . or used to be. No real need for hypereutetic pistons unless you really need that much more strength and hardness (which do you want to wear, the piston skirt or the cylinder wall, for example). Many Chrysler 4bbl motors had compression rings with an area of moly built into them, for better high-speed durability, so that would be a valid upgrade from basic OEM-spec, to me. IF you are not going hard-core HP, then normal bearings will work fine, even better in some respects, than the Tri-Metal bearings used in some factory engines. The softer normal material will let debris embed into them, whereas the harder bearings will let those things stay in the oil, as I'm told by my late machine shop operative, causing more crank journal wear and issues later on. With decent oil changes and the oils we used to have, stock bearings usually had no issue with going over 150K miles, from my experiences, in non-racing use.

So, "OEM-spec" is really pretty good stuff, generally. So aim for that orientation in searching for parts and brands of parts. THEN combine that with excellent machine work, good motor oil, and you should have an engine that will go well past 100K miles with no durability issues.

Just some observations and experiences over the years . . . yours might vary,
CBODY67
 
In the area of transmission rebuild kits, a lot different than an engine kit, by observation. Reason? While you can "know what you are looking at", generally, you really DO have to know what you are looking at with a transmission friction plate and such. Knowing that the particular item is of OEM-specs or something better or even worse than OEM-spec.

There are seal kits, kits including the "frictions", and kits which have "frictions and steels" in them. So you have to know what you need, first.

As a result, a shady transmission shop might represent their frictions to be "great stuff" when they are not even close, by observation. Selling low-level parts for not-low-level prices, for example.

Now, by observation, almost every trans rebuilder has their own little tricks and secrets to building a transmission. Things they have determined to be better for them, which does not always mean they get "a kit" from somebody, but build their own kit from many sources. One brand of bands, for example, one brand of friction clutch plates, and on and on. Which can also get more complicated on HP or high-hirsepower builds!

Consider, too, that automatic trans shifting happens when one spinning item is stopped (think "apply") as another one is released. It's that timing and modulation which determines "shift feel". Which can also be affected by how agressive the friction material might be when compared to OEM-stock items.

I'm not sure if Mopar Performance might still sell a friction and seal rebuild kit for TorqueFlites, but that might be one place to look around and get an idea of what might be out there. Might also look at www.rockauto.com, too, for more kit information, pricing, and vendor research. There are also other trans rebuild kit vendors out there too. Some have good ratings, too. But, to me, the farther you migiht stray from an OEM-level supplier of frictions (clutch plates and bands), the more generic the parts, which might affect the outcomes 20K miles down the road. Again, networking with your European operatives might be of benefit.

What issues do you perceive you are having with the transmission that is leading you into the direction of a rebuild? Just curious.

Enjoy!
CBODY67
 
Hi Folks.What’s the best engine and trans rebuilt kit for 69 Imperial? And where to buy one?Thx
My first BB build was buying How To Rebuild Your Mopar BB and reading it 3 times. All three books. Two of them for the engine and one for the TorqueFlite. 75 Bucks. That's your best and first investment.
I bought a Parts Manual.
I then knew every component of the engine and transmission (I still don't know **** about transmissions, BTW. Do not ask me about a dual clutch 10 spd.) )
I then made a parts list.
I used the internet to determine the right parts.
I used the internet to find the best price of each part. Individually or kit.

That's your kit. Only you can answer your question.

Screenshot_20220618-114130.png
 
Last edited:
What mileage and how long has it been not running (as applicable). What is the perceived desired ultimate result?

Kit? Are you wamting gaskets, seals, bearings, rings, pistons, timing chains, etc? Particular brands of these various components? Several things will be in "engine set", as rings, pistons, bearings. Gaskets will usually be in which area of the engine you are working on, which means three different gaskets sets to overhaul an engine, although some brands might have a "master overhaul set" which has everything.

One other issue is that certain items will have wear which will probably need to be machined away, to a slightly different size than original, AFTER which you can order the new parts (i.e., bearings, pistons) for these specific areas. There might be some generalities, but no "normal replacement size" to not do the machine work.

So, due to the various oversize/undersize machining operations, no generic "kit" per se, other than in the gasketing/sealing area, that I know of. Perhaps there might be, though?

Seems like, decades ago, Sealed Power used to do mix 'n match kits? Pistons of a particular type and oversize, rings to match, crank and rod bearings of a particular size (after the crank had been "worked"), plus a particular overhaul gasket set. But due to the number of variatons and age/sales of the engines that stuff was for, I somewhat doubt ALL of those earlier options might be available currently.

The OTHER thing is that many machine shops like to order the parts themselves. Not specifically so they make more money, but then THEY are in control of the sourcing of the items. That also means that if something comes in wrong or damaged, THEY are in control of getting what they need instead. Which means that related downtime can be minimized. Which means that they are not waiting on somebody else to call and get the parts needed. Some can be comfortable with the customer sourcing parts, but many are not as that "waiting for the correct parts" item is taking up space in their shop . . . space which should be making money. A variable situation.

There seems to be a quite large group of Mopar C-body people in Germany. Perhaps networking with them might be of benefit, considering your location? Some of their members have posted pictures/videos of their get-togethers over the past few years, in threads here.

Hope this might help,

CBODY67
IT"
In some respects, going for "the best" can be severe overkill and add more expense. I know, we all want "the best" for our cars, but in reality, OEM-spec might be plenty fine for our purposes. Just because a magazine article mentions a particular brand does not mean it might be better than OEM-spec, by observation. Sometimes, it might be bad, depending upon what it is, by observation.

So, after realizing this ages ago, my recommendations became "at least OEM-spec or better" rather than "the best". Now, there are some items where "the best" is better than OEM, as in Cloyes Timing Chain sets, for example. Or Fel-Pro gaskets, rather than OEM-spec, as that brand (and possibly others) now sell gaskets which far exceed what OEM-spec used to be, back then. Silvolite cast pistons are at least OEM-spec, but more reasonably-priced than some other brands . . . or used to be. No real need for hypereutetic pistons unless you really need that much more strength and hardness (which do you want to wear, the piston skirt or the cylinder wall, for example). Many Chrysler 4bbl motors had compression rings with an area of moly built into them, for better high-speed durability, so that would be a valid upgrade from basic OEM-spec, to me. IF you are not going hard-core HP, then normal bearings will work fine, even better in some respects, than the Tri-Metal bearings used in some factory engines. The softer normal material will let debris embed into them, whereas the harder bearings will let those things stay in the oil, as I'm told by my late machine shop operative, causing more crank journal wear and issues later on. With decent oil changes and the oils we used to have, stock bearings usually had no issue with going over 150K miles, from my experiences, in non-racing use.

So, "OEM-spec" is really pretty good stuff, generally. So aim for that orientation in searching for parts and brands of parts. THEN combine that with excellent machine work, good motor oil, and you should have an engine that will go well past 100K miles with no durability issues.

Just some observations and experiences over the years . . . yours might vary,
CBODY67
Thank you Sir for your excessive explanation.I really appreciate this!!! It's shame to admit, but I was so excited about the car, that I haven't take a look onto odometer, so i don't know the milage. It's not running for almost +30 years-it was stored in a barn. I haven't got on with the engine yet, so I don't know the condition of it. I just wanted to do some research about basic parts which will needed for the overhaul and make some supplies ahead. But since I don't know the inside of the engine, maybe I will wait. I don't think about hp car, just regular cruiser.I will search OEM stuff then...
 
My first BB build was buying How To Rebuild Your Mopar BB and reading 3 times.
I bought a Parts Manual.
I then knew every component of the engine.
I then made a parts list.
I used the internet to determine the right parts.
I used the internet to find the best price of each part. Individually or kit.

That's your kit. Only you can answer your question.

View attachment 538474
thank you Sir
 
First.
Tell us all about the car.
What is it.
How did you find it.
That will tell us what you need.
Pics, please.
And @ayilar will ask you for a pic of the data plate which is the most important thing to start off with.
 
My first BB build was buying How To Rebuild Your Mopar BB and reading it 3 times. All three books. Two of them for the engine and one for the TorqueFlite. 75 Bucks. That's your best and first investment.
I bought a Parts Manual.
I then knew every component of the engine and transmission (I still don't know **** about transmissions, BTW. Do not ask me about a dual clutch 10 spd.) )
I then made a parts list.
I used the internet to determine the right parts.
I used the internet to find the best price of each part. Individually or kit.

That's your kit. Only you can answer your question.

View attachment 538474
(I still don't know **** about transmissions, BTW. Do not ask me about a dual clutch 10 spd.)-hahahaha that made me laugh..... for me transmissions are like astrophysics....how does it work anyway???I will always wondering how did engineers invent that? they should get Nobel Prize!!!
 
First.
Tell us all about the car.
What is it.
How did you find it.
That will tell us what you need.
Pics, please.
And @ayilar will ask you for a pic of the data plate which is the most important thing to start off I
First.
Tell us all about the car.
What is it.
How did you find it.
That will tell us what you need.
Pics, please.
And @ayilar will ask you for a pic of the data plate which is the most important thing to start off with.
I subscribe BarnFinds.com and one day I found my 69 Imperial LeBaron 2dr there. 88yo Gentleman put his great car collection (+25 cars) on craigslist and hemmings (he also had few impressive Continentals). The face of his collection was now my Imperial. I fell in love....I wanted her so much!So I contacted him directly, since he's not on social media. He had doubts at the beginning, since his bank didn't recommend him to give me his info data for bank transfer. I talked to him serveral times and asking/begging to trust me. Eventually he agreed. I send him the money. The car was located in MI, in a barn with the rest of the collection. I stayed there since the mid of the 80ties, randomly driven. Old gentleman had a plan that he will take care his collection while retired. I didn't succeeded.What I know, the car belonged to US Army Officer William Oakey, who stationed in McDill Air Force base in Tampa, Fl (I'm trying to find and contact this gentleman)-my Imperial has original sticker of the AF BASE on the front bumper. First owner lived in River View, FL.
Unfortunately I haven't managed to get on to my Imperial yet-that's why I'm doing some research on the parts, to collect some before the overhaul. I only changed the tires, cause previous didn't hold the air, and take off the drums brakes, cause they were stuck. Now my Imperial is in Poland, where I live.
Also bought headlamps hideaway system, cause mine was missing-I have the motor, torsion bar, clips, retainers, and support etc.
From data plate I have Tuscan Bronze color...:)

IMG_6268.jpeg


IMG_7178.jpeg


IMG_7185.jpeg


IMG_5964.PNG


IMG_5965.PNG


IMG_6269.jpeg


IMG_5891.JPG


P1180295.JPG


P1180300.JPG
 
In the area of transmission rebuild kits, a lot different than an engine kit, by observation. Reason? While you can "know what you are looking at", generally, you really DO have to know what you are looking at with a transmission friction plate and such. Knowing that the particular item is of OEM-specs or something better or even worse than OEM-spec.

There are seal kits, kits including the "frictions", and kits which have "frictions and steels" in them. So you have to know what you need, first.

As a result, a shady transmission shop might represent their frictions to be "great stuff" when they are not even close, by observation. Selling low-level parts for not-low-level prices, for example.

Now, by observation, almost every trans rebuilder has their own little tricks and secrets to building a transmission. Things they have determined to be better for them, which does not always mean they get "a kit" from somebody, but build their own kit from many sources. One brand of bands, for example, one brand of friction clutch plates, and on and on. Which can also get more complicated on HP or high-hirsepower builds!

Consider, too, that automatic trans shifting happens when one spinning item is stopped (think "apply") as another one is released. It's that timing and modulation which determines "shift feel". Which can also be affected by how agressive the friction material might be when compared to OEM-stock items.

I'm not sure if Mopar Performance might still sell a friction and seal rebuild kit for TorqueFlites, but that might be one place to look around and get an idea of what might be out there. Might also look at www.rockauto.com, too, for more kit information, pricing, and vendor research. There are also other trans rebuild kit vendors out there too. Some have good ratings, too. But, to me, the farther you migiht stray from an OEM-level supplier of frictions (clutch plates and bands), the more generic the parts, which might affect the outcomes 20K miles down the road. Again, networking with your European operatives might be of benefit.

What issues do you perceive you are having with the transmission that is leading you into the direction of a rebuild? Just curious.

Enjoy!
CBODY67
Generally these are my first thoughts. The car sat for +30 years, and I don't know what I may find inside. I will dissemble it for sure and take a look inside. Rebuilding? maybe just refresh...don't know. Some things inside must've deteriorate for sure. Take off the pan and see what's inside. At least it deserve new fluid.What would you do if you have such car, not running for 30 years? Fill with transmission fluid and check if it shifts?Also just curious.
 
How many miles on the odometer?

Change engine oil and filter. Remove distributor and drive gear, prime oil pump with a drill While rotating engine so it oils the rocker arms.

Change trans filter and fluid. Drain the torque converter(it’s easy). I like Dexron fluid. Don’t know whats available to you.
 
Generally these are my first thoughts. The car sat for +30 years, and I don't know what I may find inside. I will dissemble it for sure and take a look inside. Rebuilding? maybe just refresh...don't know. Some things inside must've deteriorate for sure. Take off the pan and see what's inside. At least it deserve new fluid.What would you do if you have such car, not running for 30 years? Fill with transmission fluid and check if it shifts?Also just curious.
I would check fluids and see if I could start it (turn it over by wrench first) and move.
Obviously that would tell one a lot.

I bought a 67 T-Bird and after putting some gas, seafoam and a battery in it, drove it to the location where I did the additional inspections and work.
 
Thanks for the pictures and information! It'll be beautiful when done.

Do not forget about the rear axle lube and replacing all of the rubber hoses related to the fuel system . . . tank to carb.

In the initial stages of getting it ready to fire, might remove the spark plugs (I know, it's not easy) to squirt a few squirts of oil into each cyl. Let it soak before trying to turn the crank, with the spark plugs still removed. Might also remove the valve covers and put some oil on the rocker arm system, too. Being sure that some oil gets put down the pushrods and into the valley and hopefully cam lobes. Then drain the existing oil out of the crankcase and refill new oil before firing it off for the first time. Change the filter later.

Drain the radiator and refill with water and 1 gallon of antifreeze. Then run the engine to get it all up to heat and check for leaks. Have new radiator and heater hoses handy, too. Plus new drive belts (match the length specs on the existing belts). Then after y'all are confident there are no leaks and such, remove 1 gallon of that mixture and add one more gallon of full-strength anti-freeze (not the 50-50 mix).

Might need to run an ignition point file across the contact points to get them to fire. Then, after the engine is running reliably and such, install a new set and set the point gap/dwell to specs.

You can do all of these things incrementally. Make a list! That way, you can check off what's been done and prepare for the next steps. Rather than trying to do a lot at once, in the "banzai" orientation.

IF you might need to, should something start to not work right. Stop right then and diagnose the situation. If need be, come back on a later day to look at things with a fresh mind. Doing things slowly and incrementally might take a while, but consider this to be a learning experience that will be fun with a good outcome. It will be fun.

Take care and keep us posted on what's going on,
CBODY67
 
Last edited:
How many miles on the odometer?

Change engine oil and filter. Remove distributor and drive gear, prime oil pump with a drill While rotating engine so it oils the rocker arms.

Change trans filter and fluid. Drain the torque converter(it’s easy). I like Dexron fluid. Don’t know whats available to you.
Not really sure about the milage
 
With the huge amount of Chrysler engines in Poland:lol:, you may want to be careful.
At least clean out the oil pan and pickup before attempting to start.
 
Thanks for the pictures and information! It'll be beautiful when done.

Do not forget about the rear axle lube and replacing all of the rubber hoses related to the fuel system . . . tank to carb.

In the initial stages of getting it ready to fire, might remove the spark plugs (I know, it's not easy) to squirt a few squirts of oil into each cyl. Let it soak before trying to turn the crank, with the spark plugs still removed. Might also remove the valve covers and put some oil on the rocker arm system, too. Being sure that some oil gets put down the pushrods and into the valley and hopefully cam lobes. Then drain the existing oil out of the crankcase and refill new oil before firing it off for the first time. Change the filter later.

Drain the radiator and refill with water and 1 gallon of antifreeze. Then run the engine to get it all up to heat and check for leaks. Have new radiator and heater hoses handy, too. Plus new drive belts (match the length specs on the existing belts). Then after y'all are confident there are no leaks and such, remove 1 gallon of that mixture and add one more gallon of full-strength anti-freeze (not the 50-50 mix).

Might need to run an ignition point file across the contact points to get them to fire. Then, after the engine is running reliably and such, install a new set and set the point gap/dwell to specs.

You can do all of these things incrementally. Make a list! That way, you can check off what's been done and prepare for the next steps. Rather than trying to do a lot at once, in the "banzai" orientation.

IF you might need to, should something start to not work right. Stop right then and diagnose the situation. If need be, come back on a later day to look at things with a fresh mind. Doing things slowly and incrementally might take a while, but consider this to be a learning experience that will be fun with a good outcome. It will be fun.

Take care and keep us posted on what's going on,
CBODY67
Thank you Sir so very much!!!
 
Back
Top