What killed Plymouth's Formal?

[PeugFra]

Among the low-end full-size offerings, Plymouth took the severest beating during the Seventies. Just look how its market share dropped between 1973 and 1977:

1973: 12,26%
1974: 9,58%
1975: 8,64%
1976: 3,46%
1977: 3,19%

(For this comparison, the total market consists, besides (Gran) Fury, of Chevrolet Bel Air/Impala/Caprice (Classic), Ford Custom 500/Galaxie 500/LTD and AMC Ambassador.)

First, Plymouth loses ground during the 1974 fuel-economy obsessed model year. Still mileage for Plymouth wasn't particularly worse than for other low-end full-size car lines. Also, a complete restyling would normally entail a sales boost. Not so for the restyled 1974 Plymouth, not even relatively to its mainly unchanged competitors.

But the market share drop between 1975 and 1976 is downright catastrophic!

What did the others have that Plymouth didn't? Could it have been the boom of Broughaminess that the Gran Fury couldn't catch up with? I mean, after the demise of the 1975 4-door hardtop, the Brougham part of the 1976-77 4-door Gran Fury Brougham was mainly expressed by bright upper doorframe mouldings. No wonder North Carolina Highway Patrol had no qualms in ordering 575 of them for their 1977 fleet. That really knocks out the bottom of Brougham exclusiveness.

As for the 2-door model, even the designers themselves balked at the idea of introducing an opera window on Plymouth's C-Body. Something like a square circle. Besides, it really looks like an after-thought.

 

[70bigblockdodge]

I believe this was when the blending of interior patterns and dashboard structure became the same across the board and if you trimmed up a Plymouth it was probably more money than a base Chrysler. So why pay more for a Plymouth (typically low line) than a Chrysler (higher price class), and they were sitting on the same lot.
In other wards if you sit in a 66 Newport compared to a 66 Fury you know your in a different car. 1974 not so much.

 

[marko]

and gm introduced a smaller full size car for 1977 which would have made the big plymouth seem old

 

[68 4spd Fury]

The Fury name also went on a B body in 75 or 76 replacing the Satellite, that most likely drew customers away from the larger Gran Fury models.

 

[MoPar Maniac]

what killed the formal?
It was the wrong car at the wrong time.

 

[CBODY67]

To me, the Plymouth formals had some handsome styling on them. Less gaudy than similar Dodges, to me. But they were still considered "huge" as GM went a bit smaller, which was perceived as more fuel efficient, when the Plymouths really were more economical on the road. Plus, most of then seemed to be sold to fleets rather than retail. And, as time progressed, they didn't have the "nice interior" look that Dodges and Chryslers tended to have (on the same basic seats).

The issue of the Gran Fury and the "small Fury" probably didn't help much, either. Much of what Plymouth had always stood far was out of the minds of many new car buyers, too. The famous Road Runner lost its "hormones", so little to sell the brand by that time.

One OTHER thing was that Chrysler's dealer network was not as good as it should have been. Some of the older dealers still did pretty well, but "younger" dealers didn't know how o treat customers, by observation. Some of Chrysler's "high tech" emissions hardware had some issues and I suspect that many dealer techs didn't fully know how to fix them OR attempt to fix them. Lots of dynamics, not just the cars, were issues back then. GM dealers did a better job with their Chevys, by observation, but with a somewhat low-tech/inferior product.

Looking at things, well after the fact, can yield inaccurate conclusions, by observation. NOT unlike many of the clickbait "Worst Cars Even" articles! By people who are generating content rather than relating what they knew about back then (probably well before they were born).

To me, the '73 C-Fury had many neat styling cues that really didn't work well together, especially in certain color combinations. But in the right combination, they looked great. By comparison, the '74+ C-Fury was clean and uncluttered. Be that as it may.

Enjoy!
CBODY67

 

[PeugFra]

and gm introduced a smaller full size car for 1977 which would have made the big plymouth seem old

That was a year after Plymouth's 1975-to-1976 market share implosion. For 1976, Ford and GM's full-size cars were just as full-size as before.

The Fury name also went on a B body in 75 or 76 replacing the Satellite, that most likely drew customers away from the larger Gran Fury models.

That was in 1975, before Plymouth's 1975-to-1976 market share implosion. Sure the badge engineering wasn't helpful for the image of the name plate. But the 1975 Gran Fury was pretty much like the 1974 Fury, apart from new grilles and new names for the trim levels, so who did they think they could fool? There is a 1974-to-1975 drop alright, but it's the smallest in the list. The reshuffling does not seem to have caused any direct harm, sales-wise.

what killed the formal?
It was the wrong car at the wrong time.

Where did I read that phrase before? It may well be correct, but why?

 

[commando1]

My father was heavily in C-bodies and never considered a Fury because he thought the Dodge was more classier, WhateverTF that meant. I never understood him.

 

[GregG48203]

Ford and GM's full-size cars

To simplify the query: for some reason, the car-buying public did not find the big Plymouth as desirable as the Impala & the LTD. Fleet sales are well and good, but the only company that built a brand on them (in passenger cars) is Checker.

 

[PeugFra]

My father .. never considered a Fury because he thought the Dodge was ... classier, ... I never understood him.

Maybe I do. A Formal Dodge 2-Door pulls of the Brougham part in a much more convincing way than a comparable Fury does.

(Sorry for the wheels!)

 

[PeugFra]

... they didn't have the "nice interior" look that Dodges and Chryslers tended to have ...
Much of what Plymouth had always stood far was out of the minds of many new car buyers, too. The famous Road Runner lost its "hormones", so little to sell the brand by that time.

You could be on to something there. The Sport Fury was also long gone. But substituting muscle under the hood with a plush interior, then sell it was a challenge for Ford and GM as well.

 

[triple red]

The Plymouth Gran Fury is a nice car but I think using single headlights on an fullsize car was not the best choice.

 

[CBODY67]

The vinyl roof treatment on the above Gran Fury 2-dr, very similar to that on the smaller "Small Fury", tends to blur the lines between which one is which. It does show some family ties, but not in the best way, to me. Especially if the Small Fury got into the particular showrooms first. Not unlike Chevrolet debuting grille styling themes on the Malibu rather than the Impala, in more recent times. Which one is perceived "leader" seems a bit out of whac

I don't have an issue with the single headlights, for cosmetic reasons. They allow for a wider, thinner grille area, which can emphasize size better than vertically, as did the Dodges. Keeps the airy feel of the '65-'68 cars, which I like, more than the "more protective" '69-'73 cars. Be that as it may.

The perceived higher belt line on the Dodges, as in the '69-'73 cars, give those inside the car more of an "exclusivity" orientation, as they can't be seen as readily as in the '65-'68 cars with their lower belt line and more "airy" cabin. Same thing with the small back window on the Imperial LeBaron 4drs, compared to the higher-sales-volume Crowns. Or the smaller quarter windows and "Opera Lamps" to further shield the occupants from prying eyes wanting to see WHO is in the rear seat.

CBODY67

 

[68 4spd Fury]

That was a year after Plymouth's 1975-to-1976 market share implosion. For 1976, Ford and GM's full-size cars were just as full-size as before.



That was in 1975, before Plymouth's 1975-to-1976 market share implosion. Sure the badge engineering wasn't helpful for the image of the name plate. But the 1975 Gran Fury was pretty much like the 1974 Fury, apart from new grilles and new names for the trim levels, so who did they think they could fool? There is a 1974-to-1975 drop alright, but it's the smallest in the list. The reshuffling does not seem to have caused any direct harm, sales-wise.



Where did I read that phrase before? It may well be correct, but why?

The B body Fury lasted to 78. Somewhere in there too Dodge used Monaco on a B body while keeping the larger Royal Monaco. I assume this was an attempt to offer smaller, upscale cars with better mileage and a bridge until the R bodies came out for 79MY.

 

[1978 NYB]

With all that has been said about Formal's in this thread so far......

How does anyone explain the (over seventy) one year only changes and modifications that Chrysler made to the 1978 C-Bodies if they didn't plan on producing Formal's past 1978???

 

[68 4spd Fury]

With all that has been said about Formal's in this thread so far......

How does anyone explain the (over seventy) one year only changes and modifications that Chrysler made to the 1978 C-Bodies if they didn't plan on producing Formal's past 1978???

Hard to say except that things were going downhill fast, (financially), for Chrysler then.

 

[GregG48203]

one year only changes and modifications

This gives the marketing people something to brag about: some changes, versus no change at all. Especially important because Chrysler and Ford were two years behind GM with the introduction of the R-body and Panther.

 

[1978 NYB]

This gives the marketing people something to brag about: some changes, versus no change at all. Especially important because Chrysler and Ford were two years behind GM with the introduction of the R-body and Panther.
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Unless Mopar was planning on continuing manufacture of the C-Body why make so many changes in production if they knew they were shutting down the C's for good? A lot of the changes were continued in R-bodies but why waste a ton of money on the last year of manufacture???

 

[cbarge]

Unless Mopar was planning on continuing manufacture of the C-Body why make so many changes in production if they knew they were shutting down the C's for good? A lot of the changes were continued in R-bodies but why waste a ton of money on the last year of manufacture???

Keep in mind when the R body came out Chrysler was on the extinct list.
Money was being wasted left ,right and center until Iacocca came along.

Iacocca cut the R body out among a lot of other things linked to the corporation (marine division,big Truck division,Air-Temp division and overseas divisions) in order to save the company and build K-cars.
The F body was dropped after 1980 and left the M body as the "full size" option after the R was gone.
The Mirada and Cordoba "J" bodies were not hot sellers either.
He was dead set against the "New Imperial" but it was already approved for production before he could do anything about it at the time.
From a business standpoint he had to cut all the fat in order to keep Chrysler alive.
Eventually all the RWD cars were cut.

 

[commando1]

With all that has been said about Formal's in this thread so far......

How does anyone explain the (over seventy) one year only changes and modifications that Chrysler made to the 1978 C-Bodies if they didn't plan on producing Formal's past 1978???

That has baffled me no end. The only thing I can come up with is that one set of management was looking ahead one way and the other set of management was looking ahead a different way and TOP management was so bad that they ignored the two different paths.