How is your choke wired?????

[Justin Plant]

Morning all,

Shortly after I purchased my 75 Royal I swapped the 2245 2 bbl for an Edlebrock AVS 2. When I hooked up the electric choke I bypassed the choke control switch. It's never really started well when it's hot since. I have to feather the throttle when it's hot to keep it going till everything smooths out. Then it runs like a top. I'm just wondering if anyone here may have had similar problems and the switch fixed it?

 

[rags]

choke covers on my AFBs are wired straight to ignition. there's a thermostatic switch in the covers that shuts them off. if the choke is all the way open after warm up then it is working correctly.

 

[Justin Plant]

Well, the choke is working fine then. But this car hates starting after it's been run up to operating temp. Never had the issue before on other cars. I have the same carb on my El Camino, it's a very built big block. It starts right up.
It's quite frustrating.

 

[CBODY67]

"Hot soak re-start"? Holley also makes a "Thermistor" that completes the circuit on their two-wire electric chokes, to ground the choke coil circuit. It's supposed to vary the amount of current in that circuit related to engine temperature. When I did the electric choke carb upgrade on one of my cars, I bought it. I hooked it to the intake manifold bolt by the water crossover. I could not tell it did much good, so just connected that wire straight to ground.

On my car, the OEM ran the electric choke power circuit through an oil pressure switch (for a light) before it got to the carburetor so that the choke heater element would not operate when there was no oil pressure. I tried that, perceiving that to be a good idea. Also didn't work for me, so "direct wired" to switched power it was (per installation instructions).

FWIW, I like my automatic chokes to be adjusted as lean as possible while still starting reliably and not dying at the stop sign two blocks away. Analog or electric-operated. Usually takes some tinkering and then finessing to get to that point.

As to the hot restart issue . . . I found that using 1/2 throttle or so to get the engine to start quickly, then keeping the rpm at about 1000rpm or so (fast but not too fast) for about 10 seconds for any residual over-rich mixtures to vacate, then drop the rpm back down to normal, stabilize for a second or two, and then leave. Having the timing set correctly (for a quick start) and the ignition system in great shape helps these things too.

Just some thoughts,
CBODY67

 

[1970FuryConv]

Well, the choke is working fine then. But this car hates starting after it's been run up to operating temp. Never had the issue before on other cars. I have the same carb on my El Camino, it's a very built big block. It starts right up.
It's quite frustrating.

Does the choke close after you shut off the hot engine?
How long does it take to reopen?

 

[Gerald Morris]

Does the choke close after you shut off the hot engine?
How long does it take to reopen?

NO! If that choke is functioning at all properly, while that motor is over ~100, the choke had BETTER BE ALL THE WAY OPEN! I use only manual chokes for reasons like your situation and I pray you get it fixed.

 

[Justin Plant]

It's wide open. Wednesday night the damn thing wouldn't start. It would turn over like crazy but no start. I keep a ballast resistor in the car, I changed it. Still no start. I went inside my work and grabbed some starting fluid and and shot it into the carb and boom. She started right up and idled like nothing was wrong. This was a 9:30 pm, cool evening. It had been shut off for about an hour. That's the worst its been. Like I stated above, it's been a turd to start from the get go. Once it's running, it's a Singer sewing machine. It's got me baffled. I've been messing with old cars for 30 years, I've done dozens of carb swaps on my stuff and others, and never had a car act like this.

 

[rags]

grabbed some starting fluid and and shot it into the carb and boom.

check the accelerator pump. my '65 did this same thing when i first got it. accelerator pump was wasted.

 

[Gerald Morris]

.... I went inside my work and grabbed some starting fluid and and shot it into the carb and boom. She started right up and idled like nothing was wrong. This was a 9:30 pm, cool evening. It had been shut off for about an hour. That's the worst its been. Like I stated above, it's been a turd to start from the get go. Once it's running, it's a Singer sewing machine. It's got me baffled. I've been messing with old cars for 30 years, I've done dozens of carb swaps on my stuff and others, and never had a car act like this.

You CERTAINLY have a fuel delivery issue! Interestingly enough, I had a REMARKABLY SIMILAR PROBLEM RECENTLY with my '83 D150 /6. Turned out there was a little 1/4" backfeed hose to the tank which had sprung a leak. This hose connects to a third teat in the middle of the fuel filter, so the leak starved the carburetor when attempting to start cold, despite the excellent vacuum produced by the automatic choke. I too used starting fluid to compensate, and doubtless got piss poor gas mileage consequently. Check all your fuel lines, then the accelerator pump. You can easily do this by just goosing the carburetor hard with the breather off. If you don't see 2 streams of petrol pissing into the primary bores, then replace that accelerator pump.

If you still have a working accelerator pump, then check those fuel lines from the gas tank forward. Once the engine runs, it can pull enough petrol easily, but until it starts, those first few drops make ALL the difference! It's a quantum state matter. Wherever the defect abides, you have a LEAK of some sort. Check the fuel pump if the previous sanity checks yield no fruit.

 

[CBODY67]

I agree on the accel pump. One time, when the lead replacement additives were new, I bought a bottle of one name brand (the sodium-based one) and was using it. One weekend the '67 Newport wouldn't start easily, as normal. Many pumps of the accel pedal usually worked, except they ceased to.

What I discovered on the 9801 TQ was was that there was no accel pump output. Carefully removing the cover for the anti-pullover weight, I round the weight stuck in its bore. Obviously from some dried sodium-based lead replacement additive I was using. Got the weight out with a pair of thin needle-nose pliers, cleaned it off and such, reinstalled and no problems since. I stopped using that additive, too.

CBODY67

 

[Justin Plant]

Problem solved! Since the mishap the other night I hadn't driven the car until yesterday. No issues. I don't mean I drove it to get ice cream, I DROVE it. I tore down I 81 here in Roanoke at 80 plus miles an hour, I made several stops before spending an evening at church with friends. I decided to drive it to church this morning, I got gas along the way. No problems. I tried to go home from church, no start. Turn over but, no fire. I checked the accelerator pump, fine. I had already double checked all the hose clamps and fittings from the tank to the engine. No leaks or signs of previous leaks. I changed the tank and all fuel hoses when I purchased the car 2 yrs ago. I pulled the No. 1 plug wire, deader than 4 o'clock. I jiggled every connection I knew to jiggle and nothing. I had a second ignition module ( at home ) which is no small distance. Thankfully my wife and I drove separate cars. After doing some poking around with a test light and advise I found from this site, I felt good about changing it. The engine didn't turn half a revolution and it fired up. When I bought the car it had the original EVERYTHING under the hood, with the exception of the voltage regulator. I managed to get 4300 miles out of a "Borg Warner" ignition module from Advance. But, who knows who really made it. Either way, I'm ordering another SMP unit to throw in my box of many things.
Thanks for all the pointers gentlemen!

 

[1970FuryConv]

NO! If that choke is functioning at all properly, while that motor is over ~100, the choke had BETTER BE ALL THE WAY OPEN! I use only manual chokes for reasons like your situation and I pray you get it fixed.

Overreaction! Do you understand that it is not my car we are talking about? I was asking about what the car was doing, thus the question marks. I was not making statements about what his car should be doing, thus no periods.

 

[Gerald Morris]

Overreaction! Do you understand that it is not my car we are talking about? I was asking about what the car was doing, thus the question marks. I was not making statements about what his car should be doing, thus no periods.

Ah. so it is. No intent of seeming to shout, just stating a principle for whoever to peruse. I get you, and apologize if I seemed over-emphatic or zealous.