How Necessary is a Power Steering Cooler and WHERE to Find one for 5/8 inch hose?

[Gerald Morris]

My 2 cents.
Switch to a Saginaw
Make a cooler with more tubing the size you want even put it in airflow out front. BTU expulsion rate is not a huge concern on a stock vehicle (tall rear gear), high rpm is the reasoning behind Chrysler's use of cooler. I understand your reasoning being in your hot climate. Big John's suggestion is viable also, not with 2, 11/32 coolers, you will have to get a pair of 3/8.

That's most likely with change of engine. I have that 400 to build, with a Saginaw pump, brackets et cetera. I've liked my TRW pump thus far, but its nearing a terminal state. The bearings are dying, just as they did in the 4 yr old coolant pump. Anyway, for NOW, I want the TRW I got, as it is a RELATIVELY easy bolt-in replacement, and the proper pump for this car.

 

[Gerald Morris]

Try junkyards by grafting something from a new car. Rack and pinion steering uses higher pressure than our old cars so there is a lot of new cars with PS coolers.
Very new cars use electric assist so don't go too new.

I LIKE JUNKYARDS, WHEN I get the RARE free time to go browsing them. I have one just 1/2 mile from our domus here too, with old Mopar A and B bodies in it. He had a 66 Fury for a few months once, but some damned flipper from South Charleyland grabbed it! I RARELY get time to go junkyarding with 2 rugmonkeys in tow. They're not QUITE old enough to let loose when I go to a yard. I've tried it. I might go today for an hr or so though....

 

[Gerald Morris]

The police cars were the first place I saw Chrysler used power steering coolers. Maybe in the mid-70s on police and trailer packages (as the trailer packages seemed to have some of the same things as the police packages did). Maybe on some of the HEMI B-bodies?

Given how small they seemed to be, in comparison to the a/c condenser, for example, I got the impression that their function might have been more marginal in nature than a "real" cooler. Even though they were placed right in the 180 degree F air flow of the radiator. Rather then "out front" like a trans cooler.

One thought . . . IF they had really been effective or the ps fluid heat really needed to be decreased, GM would have been putting them on their larger carlines (which generally had a few hundred more total psi) and NOT on Chevrolets. NOW, what GM DID do in more recent times was to take a length of bare tubing (unpainted naked) and snake it around the fwd cradle on the front side for a "power steering cooler". Which, possibly have been a way to mask some harmonic in the ps fluid system? Or to make up for the fact that they needed more fluid in the system for better rack longevity?

BUT on the Slabs, probably better to find some semi-syn fluid and change it every couple of years in your climate? OR some OEM-branded fluid and just plan on changing it when it changes color.

Just some thoughts,
CBODY67

ALL GOOD Thoughts to retain in mind too! I noticed the GM, and several Nihon-jin-engines so accoutred myself too. I'm gonna look at the Borgeson rig for comparison.....

 

[Gerald Morris]

You're an electronics guy... You'll get the analogy... It's all about the flow.

So, what if you put another cheap cooler in parallel?

Just some food for thought.

I HAVE considered just THAT! Thank you John. Yes, James Clerk Maxwell majored and worked in FLUID DYNAMICS, and anyone whose bothered to think about electrical nomenclature a trifle knows that terms like "current" and "potential" plus all the particle analogies for "electrons" and such ALL are inspired from FLUID PHYSICS!

Yes, I thought about pairing 5/8" to 11/32" or 3/8" Ys to 2 modern coolers, but also weighed the relative merits of a small, modest -10 AN stacked plate cooler, and came out in favor of the latter. I admit one must sacrifice for a small constriction there though...

I reckon for NOW I'll just install the pump and worry about the cooler next weekend or next month. I have PLENTY to do to that car, be sure of that! Ohhh my back!

 

[Gerald Morris]

Agreed! I've looked under a lot of hoods from the Era and only have ever seen a few. Something else to go wrong IMO.

Yes, more **** to break, to be sure! I've not neglected THAT variable in my Cost Benefit ratios! THX.

 

[Ross Wooldridge]

PM answered...

 

[SuperDave]

I put one on my Newport, mostly because the header sits so damned close to the gearbox, which can't be good for it. I sourced mine from a police Crown Vic in a local junkyard. I spliced the low pressure return hose (just like the Crown Vic had) and mounted it in front of the radiator. It's extra insurance, can't hurt it any to run it cooler, especially since it's getting heat soaked from the exhaust. And just because I had already installed braided hoses on everything else, they got stainless braided sleeves and anodized fittings also. The ONLY hose under the hood that isn't braided is the PS high pressure hose. That'll require a trip to Napa Auto and have them fit the sleeve over it when I have them install new hose to the old fittings.

Is it needed? In my case, probably. Newer cars have them, even smaller 4 bangers & V6's, especially in a front drive sidewinder configuration. Every minivan and rear drive V8 made in the last 20+ years with hydro power steering has them. Now today's cars are made to run in excess of 100,000 miles, so that may be a consideration why they have it installed from the factory.

 

[66l78rat]

Here's the setup on my 72 Polara 360

 

[Gerald Morris]

Here's the setup on my 72 Polara 360

View attachment 459823

BravOH! I like steel braided hose and/or steel tubing. Given the minimum radius of that 5/8" hose, I'm inclined to go with rigid tubing, which I can bend handily enough, then couple with hose on a mild single flare end. But Time and Babushka's money constrain me to settle on just proper rated rubber for now.

I see you've gone All Electric for your radiator cooling too. I'm weighing the merits of this for mine. Mind you, when the NWS reports 110 F ambient, as occurs often in June, and July, having that DeRale fan spin up behind, with the A Team Perf 16" pusher up front for when idling in traffic makes for keeping that coolant at a nice 180-190 F w the 180 F Robert Shaw knockoff thermostat by Holly. I think I might do better though with a better electric fan. I plan to research it.

I like what you've done, no 2 ways about that!

 

[Gerald Morris]

A Happy Conclusion to my Present Labors:

The reman TRW did well this afternoon. I flushed the system w nearly 3/4 gallon of new fluid, then burped and bled the system with the last quart. Those 5/8" return hoses require some SERIOUS turn radius to avoid kinks! Since I'll use the length for the cooler when it arrives and is suitably prepared, I don't mind leaving a big loop of hose under the hood for now.

This marks the first time in over 5 years of ownership that Mathilda will run with a PROPER SIZED PS pump! All this time, I've used this little A Body grade 4 5/8" pump, which did an excellent job until the bearings started to go the past couple months.

Note how the belt leaned back, actually rubbing the fan pulley! The OD green 5/8" high pressure hose with the brazed fitting reducing down to an 11/32" barb to complete the return hose into the reservoir clearly betrays how inappropriate the little pump was for this car. The red RTV on the edge of the reservoir did help hold in the fluid though! It didn't ever leak.

Observe how nicely the proper sized pump sits with the old hex bolted pulley lining up perfectly with the 2nd groove on my crank pulley as it should. I replaced the old high pressure hose stump, which had MANY cracks below the woven outer green sheath, with a similar length

of new 5/8" hose, then a filter, then a big fat loop of more hose terminating into the big pump's reservoir as seen. You can also see how I retained the thick shim washers normally used for alternators to insure that the "self adjusting" pump bracket would align the pulleys square and level, as they did.

I hope to have a new shroud built of 1/8" aluminum angle fronted by an old '65 Imperial shroud to maximize the draw of my 18" fan. I actually did very nicely using aluminum FLASHING and some small angle stuff for the 22" x 16" Cold Case I replaced with this 22" x 18" one by Frank Watson. (ECP) It cools VERY well, thus far. With the shroud, I expect Great Things, but that's for Cooling....

 

[patrick66]

Find a '64 - '66 Imperial that is being parted; you'll find the wonderful factory stock unit that uses the 5/8" return PS line. Mounts longitudinally in front of the radiator, and the lines come through the radiator core support directly below the battery box. A great bit that I plan on installing on my '66 Coronet, which has the identical pump. My '66 Imperial has this cooler. Much like the police unit found on many "C"-body cop cars, I feel that the cooler does indeed help, as a '66 Imperial is nearly 5,400#. Lots of rolling real estate to keep happy at 8 mph or 80 mph.

 

[Ross Wooldridge]

Find a '64 - '66 Imperial that is being parted; you'll find the wonderful factory stock unit that uses the 5/8" return PS line. Mounts longitudinally in front of the radiator, and the lines come through the firewall directly below the battery box. A great bit that I plan on installing on my '66 Coronet, which has the identical pump. My '66 Imperial has this cooler. Much like the police unit found on many "C"-body cop cars, I feel that the cooler does indeed help, as a '66 Imperial is nearly 5,400#. Lots of rolling real estate to keep happy at 8 mph or 80 mph.

Sound familiar @Gerald Morris ?

 

[Gerald Morris]

Find a '64 - '66 Imperial that is being parted; you'll find the wonderful factory stock unit that uses the 5/8" return PS line. Mounts longitudinally in front of the radiator, and the lines come through the radiator core support directly below the battery box. A great bit that I plan on installing on my '66 Coronet, which has the identical pump. My '66 Imperial has this cooler. Much like the police unit found on many "C"-body cop cars, I feel that the cooler does indeed help, as a '66 Imperial is nearly 5,400#. Lots of rolling real estate to keep happy at 8 mph or 80 mph.

I would LOVE to find a 64-66 Imperial with running guts, as I would then PUT IT BACK ON THE ROAD if at all possible. Thanks be to God, we found Mathilda 5 yrs ago when we needed a big, solid mid-60s family car for a shoestring, and I was able to DRIVE HER HOME!! Since that happy time, the damned FLIPPERS with their filthy capitalist carpet bags since have descended on this State like locusts and carried off every piece of Mopar metal not in immediate use, and some that was, jacking the prices through the ionosphere in their greedy haste.

Be this as it was, I'm just thankful I found this Forum, and good folk who helped point me to a cooler in this case.

 

[Gerald Morris]

Sound familiar @Gerald Morris ?

Very!

 

[bnz84]

Like SuperDave my reasoning for having one is headers. They toasted the seals in the gear. I have since added some shielding to help and possibly even negate the need for for a PS cooler. But it does add extra fluid capacity so I'm leaving it until I can get temp measurements. I also have bigger heavy wider wheels. Here is pick in front of my radiator sitting below the trans cooler. The steering cooler is actually a cheaper trans cooler.

 

[Gerald Morris]

Like SuperDave my reasoning for having one is headers. They toasted the seals in the gear. I have since added some shielding to help and possibly even negate the need for for a PS cooler. But it does add extra fluid capacity so I'm leaving it until I can get temp measurements. I also have bigger heavy wider wheels. Here is pick in front of my radiator sitting below the trans cooler. The steering cooler is actually a cheaper trans cooler. View attachment 460068

A WORTHY example! Yes, I almost bought some stacked plate cooler w -10AN ports for the 5/8" hose, but opted in favor of an original Mopar unit when one became available. My B&M 70265 cools VERY EFFICIENTLY, surprising given the size, but I located it high above the road in front of my pusher fan, which actually pulls air through it before blowing into the radiator. I almost opted for plain 5/8 copper tubing.

 

[fury fan]

Older thread but worth mentioning - be extremely cautious in using copper in automotive applications.
It work hardens under vibration and can crack, esp around fittings or other areas where it has been rigidly mounted.
Heater cores are mounted/plumbed to account for that.

 

[Dan Scully]

I would LOVE to find a 64-66 Imperial with running guts, as I would then PUT IT BACK ON THE ROAD if at all possible. Thanks be to God, we found Mathilda 5 yrs ago when we needed a big, solid mid-60s family car for a shoestring, and I was able to DRIVE HER HOME!! Since that happy time, the damned FLIPPERS with their filthy capitalist carpet bags since have descended on this State like locusts and carried off every piece of Mopar metal not in immediate use, and some that was, jacking the prices through the ionosphere in their greedy haste.

Be this as it was, I'm just thankful I found this Forum, and good folk who helped point me to a cooler in this case.

Will have this one for sale, if interested shoot me a pm.

 

[Gerald Morris]

Older thread but worth mentioning - be extremely cautious in using copper in automotive applications.
It work hardens under vibration and can crack, esp around fittings or other areas where it has been rigidly mounted.
Heater cores are mounted/plumbed to account for that.

Which is why I DIDN'T use copper after all. I'll have to replace the little line for my oil pressure gauge one day, I know.

 

[fury fan]

Ironically, I generally wince when copper is mentioned on fuel lines, etc.
But I had forgotten that mechanical O.P. gauges used to include copper line - which I have used with success.