HP 69 383 or not?

[themam2000k]

Thank you very much for all the replies. So the verdict is my engine is a 383-330. I needed to know as I want to upgrade the engine and trans and put them in a lighter body for the drag strip but was not sure what I was working with. The car is a pretty decent 69 Newport Custom that I was going to put a new vinyl top on but when I jacked up the car to replace a trans gasket the windshield cracked. When I pulled the old vinyl top off both A pillars are completely rotten.

Long story short, I’m parting out the car and building another with the 383.

Thanks again for all the replies.

 

[CBODY67]

Thanks for that additional information.

I understand your concerns about what the engine actually is, BUT . . . the things that make the engine a "383HP" are inside the block rather than the block itself. Just like the differences between a Chevy 350/300 in an Impala and the same engine in a Corvette. In this case (SBC, the block can be either a normal 2-bolt main or 4-bolt main, due to horsepower levels; something that does not exist in the realm of Chrysler non-HEMI B/RB engines).

What makes the 383/335 what it is include: The camshaft (for the additional power), the windage tray (for power and oil control), and the roller timing chain (for durability and timing chain longevity). Same pistons (but with allegedly a Moly-coated compr0sesion ring). Allegedly tri-metal bearings for the crank to run in All compared to the normal 383/330 motor, as mentioned in the Dealer Data Book of specifications and features.

End result, the camshaft would be the ONLY real thing to be concerned with, to me. The only thing which could relate to an NHRA power factor to increase the 335 power rating to something higher. Of course, depending upon the class you want to run in, the cam would be removed anyway. As might the existing carb and distributor calibrations.

The "HP" stamp on the block is merely for assy line purposes, to ensure it gets the correct camshaft and pistons in it, for an upgraded 4bbl build. Just as the "hourglass" water passages on the heads deck surface. These were mentioned as being on HP and Motorhome blocks, for better water flow, BUT when you consider that only ONE side of that hourglass actually flows water, due to how the head gasket sits on the deck surface, those "hourglasses" quickly become ONLY a visual identifier of a RB440 MHC ("440-3") engine build.

SO, the more I was around my late machine shop operative, seeing engines day in and day out, the drag race engines, worn stock engines, and everything in-between, when they are all nekkid to the world on the teardown/rebuild table, what makes an "HP" engine what it is, especially a non-HEMI B/RB engine, is what's inside the block.

In looking for a new cam, COMPARE the actual cam card duration and lift specs against what the OEM specs were. EVEN IF the cam comes from the Direct Connection/Mopar Perf catalog listings! If it supposed to be an accurate repro cam, the specs should be the same as the OEM-production cam, period. NO MATTER what they call it, the specs should match exactly.

I mention this as the only REAL "Purple Shaft" cams were the 284/284 Street Hemi cam and a larger 292* cam. Maybe one larger? In later times, MP co-opted that "Purple Shaft" designation on a complete LINE of cams (probably co-opted from what used to be Crane Cams?) I wanted to mention this as a point of clarity in the usage of the "Purple Shaft" name.

These are all things I've observed over the past 60+ years as a Chrysler enthusiast. I'm NOT an expert, though, as those more involved have probably seen other things, too. YMMV

Having mentioned these things, enjoy yourself!
CBODY67

 

[58Belvedere]

I would just call it a 330 HP and call it a day.

 

[CBODY67]

As I mentioned a few posts back, the term "high performance" became a "reference issue" rather than a statement of fact. "High Performance" compared to what.

The old "Power Pack" term from the middle 1950s was more accurate, by comparison. It generally meant "4bbl carburetor and dual exhausts", no matter which brand of car it was. But was generally used generically for Chevy, Ford, Plymouth, and Rambler.

An observed issue with 383s was when Chrysler put the upswept exhaust manifolds on all of the 4bbl motors in place of the prior log manifolds . . . as standard equipment. Which muddies the waters a bit. A manifold style of manifolds from the 440/375, which harkened back to the upswept manifold on high-performance B/RB engines of the earlier 1960 drag race-oriented engines. Engines which also had internal guts to match. Camshafts and bigger (for then) valves.

That manifold design MUST have worked, or Chevrolet would not have used them on their 1990s LT1 B-cars in the 1990s (Caprices, Roadmasters, ans such). Hiding them UNDER TWO LAYERS of heat shields. BTAIM.

Sometimes we can easily read too many things into "things", though.

Just some observations,
CBODY67

 

[Toolmanmike]

Hi there,

I am trying to figure out if I have a HP motor or not. The VIN has the H code but from what I’ve read that just means 383 4 barrel. The VIN also decodes to the 727 HD trans with low geared posi in the rear end. The block does not have the HD stamp unless it’s under the edge of the heads.

Without pulling the oil pan and looking for a windage tray I thought I’d run a scope into the valve cover and look at the valve springs to see if they have the double springs. Attached are a few pics of my mystery and wanted to see if anyone can identify if the valve springs are the double spring performance springs.

View attachment 732438
View attachment 732439
View attachment 732440
View attachment 732442

View attachment 732441

No HP 383 here.

Yours is the standard 330 horse 383 4 barrel. Note the dual snorkel air cleaner vs the "Unsilenced" air cleaner.

 

[Milo]

I remember when working at a dealer a early 68 new New Yorker came off the convoy at the dealer and it had a 440 with chrome valve covers the only one I ever seen of the many cars they sold. Only 67 GTX 440 came with chrome valve covers from the factory

 

[emsteere]

To counter the point that the 335hp was never in a C body - I had a 69 Fury II police car, that I bought from the Town, that was equipped with the Road Runner 383. Wish I still had it.

 

[Toolmanmike]

To counter the point that the 335hp was never in a C body - I had a 69 Fury II police car, that I bought from the Town, that was equipped with the Road Runner 383. Wish I still had it.

Yep. Never say never with Mopar.

 

[69CoronetRT]

Yep. Never say never with Mopar.

There's no comparison of an H code PK broadcast sheet to anything like a PM broadcast sheet that shows engine assemblies were different. We can prove that the E86 440-4 engine assembly in a 'cop car' was the same assembly as used in regular passenger cars by comparing engine assembly numbers on broadcast sheets (debunking the 'police interceptor' or 'cop car' engine theories) Why would Mopar go through all the time and trouble to specifically design and assemble a 383-4 335 horse non a/c assembly for a C body cop car that would be projected to sell in incredibly small numbers? It's simply not worth the time and effort to do so when the standard 330 horse with and without a/c assembly was readily available.

There's been no credible follow up questions like "Did the car have a/c?" as there is no 1969 335 horse a/c application even in a Road Runner. RR a/c cars got the 330 horse.

The original engine could have been blown up and replaced by an engine from a RR before the person owned the car making his statement true.

There's still no documentation to go with the claim nor precedent that supports the assertion that a 383-4bbl 335 horse assembly was installed in a 69 C body.