392 Hemi 1959 Imperial?
- Thread starter crv
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It's possible that the Ghia limos had the Hemi in 1959, but 'normal' production Imperials?
I did some searching and it looks like there were 7 Ghia Imperials built with the 392. That fact seems to be repeated a few places. Is that correct? Dunno... I always say "never say never" when it comes to what Chrysler made over the years.
Post #21 in this thread has some pics of a '59 Ghia in rough shape. Projects - Hemi and mopar historians - is this real or FOS ?
Post #21 in this thread has some pics of a '59 Ghia in rough shape. Projects - Hemi and mopar historians - is this real or FOS ?
Well, there had to be a transition between 392s and 413s somewhere along the line. However, I highly doubt it was in large enough numbers for a rumour such as this.
By the way I've never heard of this rumour before today. It would have to be fully verified like it was with the onsey twosey 1972 Six packs that squeaked through.
By the way I've never heard of this rumour before today. It would have to be fully verified like it was with the onsey twosey 1972 Six packs that squeaked through.
pomonamissel
Senior Member
well this is a minor something like the 59 ghia 393 hemi , this pic is have a single pot master on a 67 d100 , but it was sold in 66 . so the required twin master cylinder mandated yet .
To verify the Hemi Imperial Limos, we would have to know WHEN Ghia got the chassis and body to modify and when those cars were built. Allowing for the time to get them shipped to Ghia, the cars may well have GOT THERE after the next year's cars (with factory 413s in them) were in production, very possibly. Especially if they were produced at the end of the Hemi-vehicle model run. Which means we would need to see Order and Sequence Numbers on the data plate, then speculate as to when those cars were built in the USA.
Considering all of the time dynamics in getting the cars built and across the water to Ghia, then back across the water to the USA, that in itself makes sense to me. Which would also indicate a build date in one model year (with the 392 Hemi) and the later sales date during the next model year.
Perhaps the OnlineImperalClub has some information in this area? Seems like I remember reading something, way back then, that the Ghia Limos could have a prior model year's "look", yet sold as new in "the next model year"? ONLY the Ghia Limos were this way, it was noted.
To me, this is not a "rumor", but very possibly "fact".
BTAIM,
CBODY67
Ghia limos did carry over year specific body design, the 1961 limousines are in fact 1960 Imperials. Cadillac did the same with the 1965 Series 75, which was a 1964 design, while the rest of the Cadillac lineup was a completely new design.
It was mentioned in the said video by a person who seems to be quite knowledgeable about Chrysler products of the time.
I found a webpage on Ghia Imperial limos at ch300imp.com/ghialimo_us.htm . It relates the story of how Chrysler and Ghia collaborated to do the '57 Imperial Limos. Chrysler initially contracted (and paid for) 75 limos. With much less than that sold in '57, it mentioned that the 1958 and 1959 Limos were actually re-touched 1957 models . . . with the 392 Hemi in them. Quite an interesting webpage!
Enjoy!
CBODY67
Enjoy!
CBODY67
Dan Scully
Well-Known Member
59-65 Cadillac 75 series limos and 59-64 commercial chassis Cadillac's (hearses, ambulance flower cars etc.) Are a 59 cowl. The limos and commercial chassis use the 59/60 dash to 62 and 63-65 use a 63-style dash. The front half on a limo or commercial chassis from 61-65 looks about the same but the back has to meet with the 59 cowl. The sheet metal from a commercial chassis and limo will not interchange with a regular Cadillac from 61-65. Starting in 65 on the commercial chassis the front groups are the same as a regular Cadillac of the same years and 66 in the limos The 59 Limo windshield which is a few inches taller was used on the limos from 59-65 and 59-64 commercial chassis. Pic of my old 61, dog leg windshield and 59 dash.
Yes, did come across it while searching, makes sense. The question remains if there were regular production Imperials in '59 factory fitted with the 392.
I think his statement about the Imperials is not describing any specific Imperial, just that there were some made with the 392. So it makes sense to me that they could be the 7 Ghias.
Yes, he was very thorough when talking about the 300s, but that comment was rather vague.
Clover
Well-Known Member
As far as I’ve always seen published, all ‘59 Imperials had the 392 Hemi. It was the only Mopar that still used it in ‘59. Imperial sometimes lagged behind tech updates, by one year. For instance, ‘68 Mopars (when optioned with it) got turn-signal stalk cruise control except the Imperial retained the old auto-pilot system.
EDIT: Big John has corrected me on the 392. I swear that back in the 80’s, I’d read that the Imperial retained the 392 for ‘59 but I can find no such reference today. It was just the Ghia-bodied cars.
I’ll just have to chalk it up to a senior moment, I guess! I know that I’m right about the auto-pilot, though.
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I have to disagree with that.
Here's part of the '59 Imperial Sales brochure. http://www.oldcarbrochures.com/stat...1959_Imperial_Brochure_2/1959 Imperial-11.jpg
Another '59 Imperial. https://www.hemmings.com/stories/article/crowning-achievement-1959-imperial-crown-southampton
Another 1959 Chrysler Crown Imperial | ClassicCars.com Journal
Clover
Well-Known Member
Well, I’ve seen different published, now!
But in the past, I’ve read that ‘59 Imps retained the Hemi but I must have missed the part where it was only the Ghia-bodied cars.
I stand corrected!
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This is correct. Chrysler built "kit" cars (there are photos of the kit no doubt somewhere on the web) and I did a thorough article on the Ghia limos in the WPC News. Jeff Godshall also did a detailed article in either SIA, or a Hemmings publication (can't recall which title/date). Chrysler built 75 of these kits and shipped them to Ghia. Between production problems in Italy, and the fact that Chrysler ended up having to rewire virtually every car that was shipped back to them, the number of cars built and sold was far less than they had hoped. So, yes, the '59 Ghias are "59-ed" 57s.
I've just had a look at the ch300imp.com website and read through the Ghia limo article. The only factual error I found was that there were two '59s built with the lift off plexiblas canopy. Once car was based at Chrysler Manhattan for visiting dignitaries and the other was used for the 1959 Royal Tour with Queen Elizabeth to celebrate the opening of the St. Lawrence Seaway. I don't know the full history of this car, but probably 40 or so years ago, I saw it in a small "celebrity" car museum in Niagara Falls Ontario. Shortly after that the museum closed and I was told a wealthy farmer bought the car. No real confirmation on this but I did pick trail 25 years ago when I was contacted by a shop in Concord Ontario (northern suburb of Toronto). They were tasked with bringing the car back to life after it had suffered at the hands of its then current owner, Marilyn Lastman, wife of Mel Lastman, the then mayor of Toronto. Lastman owned a jewellry store and the idea was that couples who bought their rings there could have use of the car for their wedding. The car had sat parked outside behind the store. The plexiblas canopy cracked, leaked and basically made quite a mess of the interior. The shop that contacted me was doing the mechanical refurb on the car and he subcontracted to a trim shop in Concord staffed by old country Italian trimmers. When they dismantled the interior of the many of the panels had notes in Italian on the backs. The Lastman's wanted the car trimmed in vinyl or some such god-awful stuff, and the trim shop refused. The shop sourced the original material for the interior and redid it properly, even sourcing a new mouton carpet from the Detroit furrier. When the bill came due, the Lastmans refused to pay it and the trim shop, slapped a lien on the car. The owner of the mechanical shop arranged to be the only bidder on the lien auction and ended up with the car. Long story short, this fellow was in over his head on doing more restoration work on the car and it ended up at the Guild of Automotive Restorers in Bradford. They completed the work on the car and somehow gained 100% ownership of the car. It was displayed at Eyes On Design in Grosse Pointe the year after it was finished, and I understood it was sold (for about $115.000) to someone in the mid U.S. Years, later it turned up in the collection of a wealthy middle eastern (Prince? King?) where it resides in ariconditioned comfort along with about 200 other cars. So the likelihood that anyone in North America is ever going to see this car again, is somewhere between nil and zero.
As for the Chrysler Manhattan car, all I was ever able to learn is that the car fell into gross disrepair and was scrapped.
Last interesting side note. When the owner of the mechanical shop arranged to have the plexiglas canopy dealt with, he had the car flatbedded on a semi to the original shop that did that conversion work, Creative Industries in Detroit. I have yet to learn the details of how the canopies were made but it involves a process called "slush casting". And a unique feature of this process is that it cost LESS to make two than it did to make ONE.
Absolute last sidenote. Ghia charged Chrysler approximately $11,000 to do the conversion on a car. Creative Industries charged Chrysler $13,000 to convert the limo just to have the lift off canopy.
As for the Chrysler Manhattan car, all I was ever able to learn is that the car fell into gross disrepair and was scrapped.
Last interesting side note. When the owner of the mechanical shop arranged to have the plexiglas canopy dealt with, he had the car flatbedded on a semi to the original shop that did that conversion work, Creative Industries in Detroit. I have yet to learn the details of how the canopies were made but it involves a process called "slush casting". And a unique feature of this process is that it cost LESS to make two than it did to make ONE.
Absolute last sidenote. Ghia charged Chrysler approximately $11,000 to do the conversion on a car. Creative Industries charged Chrysler $13,000 to convert the limo just to have the lift off canopy.
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