How Necessary ARE Some of These Specialized Power Steering Pump Tools?

Gerald Morris

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Gooood Evening Moparians!

Before I start any headstanding or other front floor contortionism in Gertrude, I have a spotty power steering pump to at least temporarily replace. It began jerking hard on the belt some weeks ago, about the same time we noticed a little noise from the OTHER accessory, the damned alternator! Talk about a cascade of troubles! I saved the alternator for eventual examination; the front bearing makes a LITTLE more noise than a really good one should, but I suspect I could use it another year before really worrying about it seizing.

NOT SO with this old TRW! I checked the fluid, finding a somewhat darker clear tan than I like, doubtless from heat and residual crap in the old steering gear, but NO PINK! I worried that the Chebbie Chimp might have perpetrated that atrocity. He's off the Hook for THAT, leaving ME to DO SOMETHING ABOUT THIS WONKY PUMP! Until September, it had served us sans trouble, and I did purge the steering gear with over a gallon of new fluid when I transferred this pump to Gertrude. But one can never be sure of any dubious "rebuild" from any but the VERY BEST folks. So, I decided to spruce up the 1968 TRW pump myself.

Removing the reservoir went FAR TOO EASILY, and I know that a fair bit of the leaking which this pump was afflicted with last year comes from that, BUT,

The front shaft seal also looks to be worn to a point warranting replacement. I took the pulley off just so I could do this anyway, so i might as well.

Yet Chrysler (Miller) Tool C-3783 no longer abounds in auto parts stores, or even ePay. Plenty cheap, and some not cheap seal tools appear to exist, some of which can be rented from The Usual AutoSlop Store as I did for the pulley puller, after my own didn't fit down past the hexagonal 1/2" shaft end. (Suppose I could have used a 5/16" nut in that to give my tool something to press against but...) Anyway, an electric impact wrench and large Crescent makes pulley removal absurdly easy with a proper puller. Will remember that for alternator work later.

I can use possibly a socket or bit of PVC pipe (3/4" Sch 40 I think) to drive a new front seal on, but am a little at a loss for improvising a seal remover here. I DON'T want to scratch that shaft!

Suggestions will be MUCH appreciated.
 

thethee

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Not the same pump, I know, but when I got a seal kit for my Federal (1.06) power steering pump a while back it also came with a new fibre gasket for the internal so I ended up completely disassembling the pump for inspection and cleaning. Don't know if you're up for that as reassembly was kind of a pain, but is sure was easy prying that front seal out of an empty pump housing lol.
 

Big_John

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I've pulled out various seals over the years by poking a small hole in the metal portion of the seal and screwing in a sheet metal screw (or a couple screws, depending on the size). A pair of vise grips and a little cussing and it comes out.

Not sure if that would work with the seal you are talking about, but that's my contribution.
 

Gerald Morris

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I've pulled out various seals over the years by poking a small hole in the metal portion of the seal and screwing in a sheet metal screw (or a couple screws, depending on the size). A pair of vise grips and a little cussing and it comes out.

Not sure if that would work with the seal you are talking about, but that's my contribution.

I saw you mention this technique in another thread, and knew I could count on you here. :) I too have used this approach on sundry seals. This one has a fairly sturdy shell, which suggests it likely was installed at the factory or during the 1970s, before Gertrude became a civilian. I see Timken still makes this seal, but have no complaint about what I got in the Edelmann kit so I'll use that.

That front seal MUST be replaced, regardless, but given several factors here, I'm inclined to shop for a tool, foreseeing a bit more of this sort of labor within the next few years, God-willing, for OTHER MOPAR A,B,C,Y bodies and/or trucks! If we can snag that acre out of town, we plan to fill part of it with "projects" to keep me occupied in my "Golden Years."

Not the same pump, I know, but when I got a seal kit for my Federal (1.06) power steering pump a while back it also came with a new fibre gasket for the internal so I ended up completely disassembling the pump for inspection and cleaning. Don't know if you're up for that as reassembly was kind of a pain, but is sure was easy prying that front seal out of an empty pump housing lol.

Very similar pump though. I take it you had to press the rotor and slip assembly out the front the same way specified for these TRWs? The pump still made good pressure, despite a FILTHY reservoir interior, as the dust actually coated all surfaces evenly and had set like paint. I generally loathe disturbing a WORKING machine, and only have proceded as far as I have with this pump because of the leaks. There is no discernible play in the rotor shaft, just leaking around it on the front.

I currently plan to replace that front seal and the reservoir O ring, then reassemble and replace the other one for a more complete examination. BUT, if I see any reason to go further, I certainly will. I've done pneumatic rotor/slip assemblies before, which are smaller, and MORE aggravating than this benignly sized one. Still, I'd 'druther NOT go any further than sealing the front, then using a shaft-only screw press to replace the pulley, though I could CAREFULLY support the shaft from the back and use my 20 ton press if needs be.
 

thethee

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Very similar pump though. I take it you had to press the rotor and slip assembly out the front the same way specified for these TRWs? The pump still made good pressure, despite a FILTHY reservoir interior, as the dust actually coated all surfaces evenly and had set like paint. I generally loathe disturbing a WORKING machine, and only have proceded as far as I have with this pump because of the leaks. There is no discernible play in the rotor shaft, just leaking around it on the front.
Apologies Gerald, I looked into it a little more just now and although these pumps look similar from the outside, it turns out that they are in fact a completely different animal... On the Federal pump everything exits out the rear of the pump body whereas the TRW pulls some out the front:

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I did however come across this video of a guy taking apart and putting back together a TRW pump, which also shows all the tools he used. Maybe it'll be of some help to you.

 

Gerald Morris

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Thanx big Big BIG bro! I saw this video referenced, but haven't got around to viewing it yet. As far as the Federal being a back door vs front door sort of rotary pump, one still has to push the rotor out to get the thing apart. This evening, I had to patch a leak in my heater hose hookup through the firewall and replace the rest of the heater hose, all after taking the Babushka to an OB/Gyn clinic for an ultrasound session of our 3rd spawn. As always, damn kiddoes make for BUSY DIZZY DAZE man.
 
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Gerald Morris

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I did the seal on a TRW a few years back

TRW p/s pump reseal
Now that I replaced the crappy front brakes on Gertrude, I can GET BACK to that pump. The front drums were swaged onto the hubs, and were the FACTORY ORIGINALS, and worn to unholy thinness by the cheap modern shoes the flipper used. I swapped backing plate with good asbestos shoes and nice newly turned Dynamic Friction drums, and she brakes MUCH smoother.

ANYWAY, THANK YOU FOR AN EXCELLENT THREAD AND A JOB WELL DONE! Your method of popping that seal will be mine, as I have plentiful punches and small chisels, all top grade stuff to do that old seal shell quickly and easily. I have Lubriplate grease in several forms, thx to a friendly industrial supply, which I'll use as you did the petroleum jelly. (Mind you, I primed my oil pump w vaseline until I wised up and switched to 10W-30.)
 

Gerald Morris

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Final update! Installed the re-sealed, cleaned pump back to the car and steering gear it was made for and mated to in 1967 for the '68 lineup! Not a drop leaks from the pump, and it runs a little smoother than the older pump I scored off eBay a couple yrs ago for $85. NOW, I can open that one at my leisure, and see what can be done for it. I suspect one of the slip springs may not be doing its job so well any longer, as it doesn't rotate quite so smoothly as it did when I installed it. I will FIRST CLEAN IT OUT WELL, before opening anything, as the fluid in the power steering system has a nasty brown tint, suggesting more rat excrement having been in the system or such. IDKWTF this should be so, as I flushed the whole system out with 8 quarts of fresh power steering fluid when I put that pump on last Fall, but I can't discount the evidence of my senses right now. I WILL FLUSH the system again as soon as I can score another couple gallons of Sprawlmart PS fluid to do it with. At least the pump itself was clean this morning. It also aligns VERY nicely with the crank pulley now. I bought a new snubber for the bracket AND left about 1/8" of pulley past the end of the shaft when pressing it on, and, sure enough, NOW it aligns perfectly. The bracket itself is properly square and straight also, and will remain so. I used an alternator spacer washer with the other bracket. I'll get another snubber for that one, and carefully square it back up too....

Eye-candy below:

1670103107837.png

I've never had a straighter, truer power steering belt than this one! This pump should run a long time this way. Notice the return hose. I kept the short bit of 5/8" return line off the gearbox to the filter, showing right below the reservoir return port in this pic. Yet observe that the return line attached indeed measures as 3/8" ID hose! Turns out that the OD of THIS 3/8" line comes to 5/8"! NICE and HANDY that way, isn't it? I just plugged a couple inches of the new 3/8" return line into a short stub of the 5/8" stuff I kept on the pumpward side of the filter, then double clamped things down with the 3/8" line butted right onto the end of the filter. One clamp secures the 5/8" stub to the filter, while the second holds the 3/8" line snugly inside the stub. Both hoses came from Advance Auto, FWTW, but the 5/8" stuff wears VERY well. I expct no trouble with this arrangement. I have a 3/8" return spout which came with the gear still on the car, but I like my extra inline return filter in addition to the little screen inside the reservoir. Here the 5/8" line offers one advantage; a better reservoir return filter in the hose return port. It was CLEAN on the pump I removed, and I had nothing discernable caught in the extra filter either. I still don't like that brown tint to the fluid, which is just 1 yr old.

Unfortunately, I need to change out the rear end, then rebuild the front suspension on this car. We're making good, steady progress in repairing and upgrading things, but it ALL is forced by the deterioration of this vehicle, most of it on factory original parts, so I certainly am not complaining! I suspect the rear end got seriously abused by one or more former owners, all the same, as did the original engine. THAT will be revisited in 2023, Deo volente, though the 400 also calls.....
 
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