Lower the temp for next summer.

[Just Carbs]

Good Morning All
Have done some more research on the radiator/fan clutch issue.
It would make sense that overheating in slow/stopped traffic MAY be caused by a lack of adequate air flow. All seals are are in place so that leaves the fan. As stated, water pump was replaced (440 source).
The car did not originally come equipped with a fan clutch so my research as research shows that the Hayden 2747 is listed as a replacement. That now leads to a replacement fan as solid fan drive is different. I have a couple of clutch fans in the 'stash' A Mopar 2863215 and a GM from a '66 GTO. Both fans are the same diameter (either 17.5 or 18, hard to measure), number of blades (7) and mounting dimensions. The only visible difference is the blade pitch (photos below). Both will mount up with about .75 inch clearance from the radiator. Apparently Mopar Performance recommends .5 inch but it should still work,
The GM fan appears to be more aggressive that the Mopar. Other than possible noise, (and the fact that it is GM) would there be other down down sides?

Thanks to all who respond.
Omni

Mopar FanView attachment 625858
GM FanView attachment 625859

I don't think the GM will be a roaring problem with a thermal fan clutch unless it's doing towing duty up long grades in second gear in hot weather that would engage it.
Then it's going to suck up lots of noticeable power to run it up that hill at 3k rpm if it does engage. Bunches and bunches.

 

[Gerald Morris]

Good Morning All
Have done some more research on the radiator/fan clutch issue.
It would make sense that overheating in slow/stopped traffic MAY be caused by a lack of adequate air flow. All seals are are in place so that leaves the fan. As stated, water pump was replaced (440 source).
The car did not originally come equipped with a fan clutch so my research as research shows that the Hayden 2747 is listed as a replacement. That now leads to a replacement fan as solid fan drive is different. I have a couple of clutch fans in the 'stash' A Mopar 2863215 and a GM from a '66 GTO. Both fans are the same diameter (either 17.5 or 18, hard to measure), number of blades (7) and mounting dimensions. The only visible difference is the blade pitch (photos below). Both will mount up with about .75 inch clearance from the radiator. Apparently Mopar Performance recommends .5 inch but it should still work,
The GM fan appears to be more aggressive that the Mopar. Other than possible noise, (and the fact that it is GM) would there be other down down sides?

Thanks to all who respond.
Omni

Mopar FanView attachment 625858
GM FanView attachment 625859

I use a 1965 Mopar 2524984 22" radiator on my 383, driving in Tucson AZ SUMMER HEAT IN TRAFFIC yet I would NEVER advise you to get anything BUT a 3 row 1965 radiator! They're WONDERFUL! I DO supplement that radiator with 2 items, to obtain constant sub 200 F temperature in urban summer driving.

1.) I use a 16" electric fan as a pusher in front of the radiator, which I have on a toggle switch or a 210F thermal switch. The only time it reached 210 was while backing in to my car port. Then the fan would kick on if I hadn't already turned it on when turning off the main street. The main SUMMER* fan is a Mopar 18.5" 7 blade clutch fan with the 1965 metal shroud meant for the radiator. Shrouds are dandy, .... when moving down the street with the engine turning over 600 rpm.

2.) The REAL pleasant SURPRISE is the external B&M transmission cooler. I sit it behind where the front license plate is meant to go, which gives it ideal air flow. Placing it UPLINE from the radiator trans cooler removes a LOT of heat from the tranny fluid BEFORE this gets dumped into the radiator! So, the radiator then only cools the engine.

You can get both of these items for just under $200, and your ride will stay cool in Downtown Hell. Do it man.

*I remove the big steel salad chopper in November, replacing it in May for the HOT Season here. My FFD fan does fine during the Moderate Season here.

 

[Omni]

Gerald
Thank you for the reply and the break-down of what you use.
I DO have the 3 row 22" radiator and shroud (sourced from Murray Park).
I had it re-cored two seasons ago.
I have a fan clutch coming (2747 Hayden). I also have a 2863215 7 blade Mopar fan that I will try first. I also have a 7 blade GM with a more aggressive blade pitch.
As the 383 has add-on A/C (that is shut off in traffic), I may have to go the pusher fan route. Do you have a particular brand/part number that you use?
I hadn't thought of a separate tranny cooler. Again what particular brand/part number?
I will try these 'improvements' one-at-a-time to see what improvements are made.

Thanks Again for you response
Omni

 

[Jakter]

Lose the high flow thermostat and put in what the factory installed.

 

[Gerald Morris]

I had it re-cored two seasons ago.

XLNT! I need to do likewise, as both of mine are very old, and leaky. I can only patch so much. I figure I'll get US Radiator to furnish a new core, and plan on adding another row, but retaining 9/16" spacing for better air flow. This matters a lot. I realize if I used the high efficiency spacing, I could squeeze in as many cooling tubes in 3 rows as I would with 4 on older spacing, but again, having PLENTY air flow around your radiator is VERY useful! I'll stick with the older convention here. You, having the dealer air just as our '66 Newport did, should use every cooling trick you need.

I have a fan clutch coming (2747 Hayden). I also have a 2863215 7 blade Mopar fan that I will try first. I also have a 7 blade GM with a more aggressive blade pitch.

I used the 2747 for 3 yrs until it was wrecked. I now run a NOS Mopar clutch. Macht im der Bundesrepublik Deutschland ca 1990. The fan is a 2.25" pitch Mopar 7 blade. Its off for the cool season,

As the 383 has add-on A/C (that is shut off in traffic), I may have to go the pusher fan route. Do you have a particular brand/part number that you use?

I used to good effect the cheap A Team 16 inch fan at first but now run this one from FFD:FFD16-3600CFM This cools Gertrude's 383 nicely by itself nowm though in the hot season I need that big chopper too.

I hadn't thought of a separate tranny cooler. Again what particular brand/part number?

I can't find the EXACT part number, but its very similar to THIS B&M: B&M 70255 B&M SuperCooler Oil Coolers | Summit Racing
Stacked plate coolers work wonders for their size. Remember, oil cools differently from water solutions. I got my cooler from Speedway, but they don't carry it now. I suspect what I linked supercedes it. Cooling the transmission is VERY important, in its own regard AND by separating it from engine heat too.

I will try these 'improvements' one-at-a-time to see what improvements are made.

Thanks Again for you response
Omni

You're MOST welcome, and I will close with one MORE improvement which matters: the thermostat. GET A GENUINE ROBERTSHAW FROM FLOWCOOLER AND NEVER LOOK BACK! I now happily own about 3 bona fide RobertShaw 370-180 thermostats. Look in the FSM, and LO! THE THERMOSTAT SHOWN IN THE FSM LOOKS JUST LIKE A ROBERTSHAW! I've tried the Mr. Gasket knockoff, with some good result, but the Real Deal RobertShaw works MUCH better. Made in U.S.A. vs. Eastasia-slave-labor usually does. Usually. Do it. Look on this Forum ever so often. You might get somebody to part w their stash.

Cool Running to ya Omni!

 

[Omni]

Gerald
Thanks so much for the info on the fan and trans cooler.
Was looking at the B&M and a Hayden #676. Physical dimensions are very close, it is a plate style but what it doesn't tell me is #of cooling rows. (The B&M has 27.)
I am running a Robert Shaw type thermostat That also looks like the factory style (at least by the service manual pics). While the 'Barge' is in dry dock I will pull it out and check. Have to drain the radiator and remove it for the install of the fan clutch.
I was under the impression that that style was considered a 'high flow' - may be wrong on that.
Omni

 

[Gerald Morris]

Gerald
Thanks so much for the info on the fan and trans cooler.
Was looking at the B&M and a Hayden #676. Physical dimensions are very close, it is a plate style but what it doesn't tell me is #of cooling rows. (The B&M has 27.)
I am running a Robert Shaw type thermostat That also looks like the factory style (at least by the service manual pics). While the 'Barge' is in dry dock I will pull it out and check. Have to drain the radiator and remove it for the install of the fan clutch.
I was under the impression that that style was considered a 'high flow' - may be wrong on that.
Omni

Never mind the terminology of amateurs. The RobertShaw was THE thermostat for ALL Mopar B/RB blocks, and the earlier A block engines too. HIGH FLOW IS GOOD FLOW! That stupid **** about restricting the flow to let coolant sit in the same damned spot for long periods will destroy your motor. The folks at FlowKooler know what they're doing. Get the B&M cooler. Hayden is trash, both their coolers and their clutches. My own octogenarian transmission guru schooled me on which stuff to get and why. I use one of the early NON AC Mopar water pumps also, to excellent effect. For you, get the FlowKooler pump. Coolant needs to flow about the entire system well enough to maintain UNIFORM TEMPERATURE, which, with that excellent radiator you have, combined with a few needful supplements I suggest, will keep your 383 just above 180 degrees Fahrenheit, even in urban traffic in July. The only difference between your setup and mine is that you run that dealer AC, while I ditch any AC, always, and have since 1979 while driving in Texas.

 

[Jakter]

If the car needed all that high-flow stuff to keep cool it would have been put on in the factory.

 

[Gerald Morris]

If the car needed all that high-flow stuff to keep cool it would have been put on in the factory.

It WAS! Read the FSM

. Look a little familiar there? Hmmm?

 

[Jakter]

It WAS! Read the FSMView attachment 626449. Look a little familiar there? Hmmm?

Nope.
I've had/have Flathead 6's, 3.9v6's, 301's,318's 325's, 383's, 413's and 440's and I have never removed and replaced a thermostat that looked like that, just put in the temp. the FSM called for that the parts store had.

Never replaced a water pump with anything to do with a high-flow water pump but replaced many with whatever was on the parts shelve.

Never had to change to a non-stock radiator.

Never had to add electric fans to supplement the factory fan.

Most certainly never had to add an after-market trans cooler to keep coolant temps down.

Never had a coolant temp. problem on many cars of all brands.

The OP I believe has a stock 383 2v, if you can't keep it running at proper temps. in factory configuration, he has a problem somewhere that all the silly add-ons you prescribe will not fix.

Oh, one more thing, I owned, put back on the road and currently drive daily Mopars for a lot longer than 2004.

 

[Just Carbs]

In 1969 Dad drove the bone stock 40k mile 64 361 A/C through the Miss Delta in 100 degree and 100 percent.
State 82 was a two-lane 60mph road. It was 5 mph for three hours because of an accident.
Lots of Ford and Gm steaming on the shoulder, but no Mopar's.

 

[Omni]

A quick update on the 'Barge'.
Upon closer examination of the fan that was on the motor it is NOT a stock fan (at least I've never seen a stock fan with elongated mounting holes. The car had aftermarket A/C installed sometime between 1965 and 2021, so I can only guess that the original a four blade was swapped for this one.
Anyway, the hunt is on for a compatible A/C clutch fan that will work with a shrouded 22" radiator. Have seen several on E Bag but most are 20". That doesn't leave much clearance for the shroud. One is said to be 19" but no part numbers are provided.
I did find a 18" 5 blade that was apparently a mopar aftermarket that looks interesting. Researching that (mainly on the FBBO site) many rave about its ability to cool built motors. There are a couple on E Bag that are relatively inexpensive
so I purchased one to give it a shot. When it arrives I'll update that.
Still on the lookout for a FACTORY fan. The parts books via My Mopar are great for researching part numbers but after '65 when Mopars got both 22 and 26 inch radiators, the parts book do not give much info on fan diameters.
I have several part numbers that were common to both "B" and "C" bodies. As the "B's" had the smaller radiator, they should perform satisfactorily.
Good thing it is winter, as this may take awhile.

Omni

 

[Unix]

Nope.
I've had/have Flathead 6's, 3.9v6's, 301's,318's 325's, 383's, 413's and 440's and I have never removed and replaced a thermostat that looked like that, just put in the temp. the FSM called for that the parts store had.

Never replaced a water pump with anything to do with a high-flow water pump but replaced many with whatever was on the parts shelve.

Never had to change to a non-stock radiator.

Never had to add electric fans to supplement the factory fan.

Most certainly never had to add an after-market trans cooler to keep coolant temps down.

Never had a coolant temp. problem on many cars of all brands.

The OP I believe has a stock 383 2v, if you can't keep it running at proper temps. in factory configuration, he has a problem somewhere that all the silly add-ons you prescribe will not fix.

Oh, one more thing, I owned, put back on the road and currently drive daily Mopars for a lot longer than 2004.

i must agree on this one. Have a stock 383 2V , 71' , stock rad, stock fan (non clutch), stock shroud. It can run all day long with AC engaged in stop&go city traffic, in 90F heat and won't overheat. Thermo is 195F

 

[Gerald Morris]

i must agree on this one. Have a stock 383 2V , 71' , stock rad, stock fan (non clutch), stock shroud. It can run all day long with AC engaged in stop&go city traffic, in 90F heat and won't overheat. Thermo is 195F

Straight fans DO cool well! Mind you, at high rev's, they load the engine a bit, but my first summer running the 383 I yet use I ran a 6 blade rigid fan with that 2524894 radiator without any overheating. I still have that old treasure, in case I get another body and engine to get moving on a low budget. There was NO shroud, and I checked on the car VIN, and suspect there never was one. Now I have the shroud meant for that radiator, from a '65 Fury, and it does alright when I run a salad chopper on the engine for the hot season here. My FFD 3600 cools the engine very nicely in the cool season, when needed.

 

[Gerald Morris]

A quick update on the 'Barge'.
Upon closer examination of the fan that was on the motor it is NOT a stock fan (at least I've never seen a stock fan with elongated mounting holes. The car had aftermarket A/C installed sometime between 1965 and 2021, so I can only guess that the original a four blade was swapped for this one.

Very likely, since its a non-Mopar one.

Anyway, the hunt is on for a compatible A/C clutch fan that will work with a shrouded 22" radiator. Have seen several on E Bag but most are 20". That doesn't leave much clearance for the shroud. One is said to be 19" but no part numbers are provided.

Mine is a 2863215 Mopar 18" 7 blade, 2.25 inch pitch fan, very common in the early 1970s. I only use it in the summer. I scored it at our neighborhood junk yard for $20. You might find one like it, or the 2863216 fan at 18.5" w a 2.5" pitch on ePay for a reasonable price, or NOT. Some bloodsucking flippers have priced them absurdly high, after a paint job. Either will do nicely with your setup. In the autumn/winter, I use only the electric fan, intermittently as needed.

I did find a 18" 5 blade that was apparently a mopar aftermarket that looks interesting. Researching that (mainly on the FBBO site) many rave about its ability to cool built motors. There are a couple on E Bag that are relatively inexpensive
so I purchased one to give it a shot. When it arrives I'll update that.

XLNT! I betcha its like one of the 2 I mentioned.

Still on the lookout for a FACTORY fan. The parts books via My Mopar are great for researching part numbers but after '65 when Mopars got both 22 and 26 inch radiators, the parts book do not give much info on fan diameters.
I have several part numbers that were common to both "B" and "C" bodies. As the "B's" had the smaller radiator, they should perform satisfactorily.
Good thing it is winter, as this may take awhile.

A good old school 22" 3 row copper radiator from the mid 60s cools very nicely. Stick with the 252abcd series. I copped a couple aluminum radiators, one good, another not so, and those will cool for awhile, but if of sino-aluminum, almost inevitably will dissolve due to simple bi-metallic electrolysis and poor quality aluminum. If you're strapped for $, get one from ECP, as an intermediate solution, and avoid Cold Case. If you got a grand, get one made by US Radiator, or maybe OER, if they don't use US Radiator. (I suspect they do.)

My next radiator improvement probably will be a 4 row copper rad, but keeping the old 9/16" spacing. Why? AIR FLOW! Yes, the high efficiency 3/8" spacing enables you to cram more tubes into
the same width radiator, but I like some spacing between those tubes, to better dissipate the heat.

Do yourself THIS FAVOR: 38-78 Mopar OEM 180 Degree HI FLOW Thermostat Dodge Chrysler Plymouth NOS | eBay

It's a Mopar RobertShaw thermostat! I use these and naught else now for Gertrude, and even got the analogous ones for the little 225 /6 I run in our Dodge D150. This is what MoPar liked, put their factory brand name on for their serious V8s and even depicted as canon in their FSMs during the Slab Side days. While I don't suppose there is an "exploding dog" clause on these, anymore than my GNU OS or software, its simply the best stuff to run. The Mr. Gasket copies do alright, but don't last as long.