RV 440 and 727

[440Chauncey]

I recently got a 440 engine complete with a 727 trans. The block was cast in 74 and the numbers read 4006630. I plan on putting this in a car someday. What I noticed was the spark plugs were smaller but the heads looked like a 906 cast. I did some research that on some RV 440's there was a different type of water pump with special types of heads. The heads I have look normal with a standard big block water pump. Does anyone know anything about these? I took the valve covers off and there was still assembly markings on the top and the valve springs were painted Chrysler turquoise. They look really clean but would they be any good to use, or are they even worth keeping?

 

[commando1]

440 RV blocks used a head with extra cooling passages. They require what is called a GM "peanut plug".
The correct plug is never listed on the charts so people are always installing the regular plugs which screw up the seat and the threads.

The RV peanut plug heads are listed in the books as 440-3. The casting number of these heads can be either 906 or 452 which is why a lot of fistfights started on "what is the # of the RV heads"

You want Champion OBL9Y 14mm tapered seat, gap = .035", no gasket.

Other than the use of different plugs, all other external parts are identical.

 

[Big_John]

From what I've read about those heads, they are pretty much similar to a 452 casting only with a tapered seat "peanut" plug. As Stan said, that is supposed to be for extra water passages. I have also read that the valve guides may need to be cut down for higher lift cams or double springs.

Check the exhaust manifold bolt pattern before you do anything else. As I understand it, there are two different patterns that were used. I've never run across it, but have heard about it on RV and industrial engines.

 

[commando1]

As I understand it, there are two different patterns that were used

No need to worry about exhaust manifold. Same bolt pattern.

 

[Big_John]

No need to worry about exhaust manifold. Same bolt pattern.

Yea, I think that you only see that on those 413 engines with the water pump passages... But... I'd hate to say that 100%. It's just enough of a chance and takes nothing to look at (they are quite a but different).

 

[Big_John]

You know.... Now I gotta pull my 440 book out and look at it....

 

[commando1]

You know.... Now I gotta pull my 440 book out and look at it....

For every rule there are 10 exceptions.
The Mopar corollary:
For every exception, there are ten more exceptions

 

[Big_John]

For every rule there are 10 exceptions.
The Mopar corollary:
For every exception, there are ten more exceptions

Well... Crap.... My big block Mopar book doesn't say a word about RV heads.

 

[commando1]

Well... Crap.... My big block Mopar book doesn't say a word about RV heads.

Seriously, I knew that. I wanted to see if you came up with something I missed.
I learned 95% of what I learned about the RV heads through the Winnebago and other RV forums. Even on Moparts, they were clueless.

 

[70bigblockdodge]

I will never say absolutely 100% but the funny heads have a water fitting right in the front , coolant does not have to pass back through the block to get to the water pump housing and thermostat neck. These heads are the ones with the different exhaust bolt pattern, mostly 413s

These are a couple of pictures best could find, top one shows exhaust and funny spark plug location. Bottom one shows the coolant flange /plumbing. They also had reverse rotation cams that were gear driven, they did not have a idler gear like modern gear drives have to keep cam spinning the same as with a timing chain.

 

[commando1]

They also had reverse rotation cams that were gear driven

That means it was a reverse rotation marine engine. Different engine. Different cooling. We're talking RV heads here,

You're trying to find the exemption to the exemption to the exemption,..
K. I. S. S.

 

[70bigblockdodge]

No crank went same direction cam spun backwards or counterclockwise looking from front to back.

 

[Big_John]

View attachment 92506 No crank went same direction cam spun backwards or counterclockwise looking from front to back.

Never heard of that and my brain hurts thinking about how the cam timing would work out.

 

[commando1]

View attachment 92506 No crank went same direction cam spun backwards or counterclockwise looking from front to back.

Look at the water pump housing. Is it a reverse flow?

 

[commando1]

Never heard of that and my brain hurts thinking about how the cam timing would work out.

Air is sucked in through the exhaust valve and pushed out the intake. That's all.


Just joking.

 

[cantflip]

Zero experience with stationary engines... but the changes are impressive, as was the work they were intended to do.

 

[72Fury]

View attachment 92506 No crank went same direction cam spun backwards or counterclockwise looking from front to back.

I ran across a pair of 413's out of an old wood Chris Craft several years ago. One ran counterclockwise.

 

[65sporty]

Worked on a few twin engine boats and one always spins counterclockwise that way they go straight.

 

[70bigblockdodge]

Never heard of that and my brain hurts thinking about how the cam timing would work out.

International harvester gas truck engines were all done this way.

I ran across a pair of 413's out of an old wood Chris Craft several years ago. One ran counterclockwise.

Did they have the different heads?

 

[72Fury]

International harvester gas truck engines were all done this way.

Did they have the different heads?

I don't remember the heads being different. Certainly not the small plug rv heads. They did have of course the big water cooled exhaust manifolds, and different (for a boat) air cleaners.

Sometimes the side that runs reverse is done by the outdrive and not the engine, but not on this one.