1969 - 1971 C body Stub Frame (subframe)

[Big_John]

John, I did post a few photos of the differences though they may not be exactly clear on what is what. As I said, both the same height

Yea, I think I'm not 100% sure what I need to look at. I see there is no rubber isolator.

 

[sevnt300]

I don't know why the attachments did not come through in the last post. Lets try again!



Rigid frame radiator core support measures about 15 inches from where it mounts to the frame



TQ frame radiator core support measures about 14 inches from where it mounts to the isolators that mount to the frame



Both measure the same in the middle of the radiator about 21 1/2 inches



TQ frame ​ Rigid frame


If you notice there is an extra gusset running from the top to the bottom and an offset bracket for the rubber isolator on the TQ frame.
The rigid support has no extra gusset with no provision for the rubber isolator. The wheel houses bolt up to their respective core support or "yoke" so the rigid mount wheel
house would be too long for the TQ yoke and the TQ wheel house would be too short for the rigid mount yoke. Small difference but
enough to make your life hell when trying to assemble the car. You can see the same in the pictures posted by polara71

 

[Samplingman]

It's that extra gusset that has had me confused for so long. I was convinced I had the wrong support because the gusset was missing, but in reality that's one of the major differences between rigid and TQ, or for 1970 hardtops and convertibles. Seeing the two gussets on Big John's vert makes perfect sense now.

1970 hardtop:

1970 convertible:

 

[Samplingman]

Hey Big John - if ever we should meet when my vert is done, I'd love to swap rides for a short cruise just to feel the difference between TQ and rigid in a vert. That would be a once in a lifetime comparison!

 

[Big_John]

Hey Big John - if ever we should meet when my vert is done, I'd love to swap rides for a short cruise just to feel the difference between TQ and rigid in a vert. That would be a once in a lifetime comparison!

Carlisle!

 

[Samplingman]

Carlisle!

Yes! May not be for a couple of years though...

 

[Donny]

If you pull the Inner and Outer front Fenders off a 70 C Body, like my 300, also remove the Hood, lift the car up on a lift and you'll see the Sub Frame move like 1-2 inches in 'give' from these rubber isolation bushings! So, the Inner Fenders and outer Fenders really serve to keep the entire front 'tight'.

 

[polara71]

Thats better ..............and much more understandable to the guy without one of each side by side

 

[commando1]

I wish you could lay the two of them flat down, one posed over the other,
and could shoot down with a camera while standing on a ladder.
But man that's a lot of work....

 

[polara71]

Im not taking mine apart but that would be insightful

 

[Big_John]

Perhaps this is a dumb question, but what is the non TQ mounting like for the rest of the frame?

The front mounts solid, with maybe a shim or two to level and the core support is longer for that purpose, but does the rear portion mount up flush to the floor pan? Or is there a spacer?

 

[polara71]

Perhaps this is a dumb question, but what is the non TQ mounting like for the rest of the frame?

The front mounts solid, with maybe a shim or two to level and the core support is longer for that purpose, but does the rear portion mount up flush to the floor pan? Or is there a spacer?

Best I could do with the camera body against the floor...

1971




1970

 

[Samplingman]

I wish you could lay the two of them flat down, one posed over the other,
and could shoot down with a camera while standing on a ladder.
But man that's a lot of work....

I have the vert support out, but not the hardtop. If I come across one I would do it.

 

[sevnt300]

Perhaps this is a dumb question, but what is the non TQ mounting like for the rest of the frame?

The front mounts solid, with maybe a shim or two to level and the core support is longer for that purpose, but does the rear portion mount up flush to the floor pan? Or is there a spacer?

The front of the rigid mount frame bolts up to the same spot on the body as the TQ frame but the outriggers are a different size and shape and they bolt frame to body (metal to metal) no shims. The rear mounting points are also bolted frame to body at the torsion bar crossmember, it has two bolts that attach to the crossmember that is welded to the floor to the frame, one bolt from the top and one from the rear. If your frame is within specs, any adjustments to the body panels should be done with shims where they attach and not on the frame where the body mounts.


Front Mount



Rear Mount

 

[1970FuryConv]

I had a 73 New Yorker 4-door hard top that rotted out around the area pictured on both sides of the car. When that happened, I sold the car to a local mechanic, who claimed he was going to fix it and drive it. He drove it away with the front subframe rocking up and down below these rear mounts. It was NJ/NY car, so it was probably the local weather, but are 1973 cars prone to rusting out in this area?

 

[polara71]

I believe any all year long driven car of the time had the odds against it

 

[commando1]

1967 8 owners year round 122k

(Has protective coating)

 

[commando1]

Let's add this useful info to the thread:
http://www.hamtramck-historical.com/images/TSBs/1970/70-23-8 page1.jpg

For links to all 6 pages of TSB 70-23-8 Go to:
http://www.hamtramck-historical.com/1970-TSB-Index.shtml

Page One of six:

 

[commando1]

 

[1970FuryConv]

My 73 New Yorker must have rusted out at stations 2 and 3. As I remember it, the subframe gave out and was hanging about 3 inches below its mount at station 3. The quarters were badly rusted too, although the rest of the car was OK.