Fuselage common rust area, why?
- Thread starter Dodgy Dick
- Start date
Back when the cars were new and shiny, we NEVER suspected or envisioned that they'd be around this long. "Antiques" at that time were usually old flathead Ford Model As and Ts, by observation. Cars prior to about '53 were just cars to be used and discarded when done. The bigger cars were salvaged for their bigger engines by the hot rodders. Plus the stronger rear axles and transmissions.
Rust proofing was not very good, as were the exterior paints and related seam sealers. But they were good for the time. Even by the '70s, things were much better, but still not as good as the current models seems to be (body sealing and such). The popular cars got repainted and re-used as the others got traded-in about 4 times and then ended up in the local salvage yards.
There were always comments about how the sheet metal under vinyl roofs was not painted, just primered, back then. NOW we know for sure what happened.
Body caulks, sealers, seam sealers, weld-thru sealers, etc. are now so much better than anything every envisioned in the middle '60s that it's not funny. As noted, the 3M AlumaLead filler was designed specifically for the rear window areas of GM cars (which had more problems earlier on). Then came the many rust remover and rust encapsulator coatings. A much better playing field than even 20 years ago.
Fix 'em better. Make 'em faster. Make 'em look better for many years into the future!
Enjoy!
CBODY67
Rust proofing was not very good, as were the exterior paints and related seam sealers. But they were good for the time. Even by the '70s, things were much better, but still not as good as the current models seems to be (body sealing and such). The popular cars got repainted and re-used as the others got traded-in about 4 times and then ended up in the local salvage yards.
There were always comments about how the sheet metal under vinyl roofs was not painted, just primered, back then. NOW we know for sure what happened.
Body caulks, sealers, seam sealers, weld-thru sealers, etc. are now so much better than anything every envisioned in the middle '60s that it's not funny. As noted, the 3M AlumaLead filler was designed specifically for the rear window areas of GM cars (which had more problems earlier on). Then came the many rust remover and rust encapsulator coatings. A much better playing field than even 20 years ago.
Fix 'em better. Make 'em faster. Make 'em look better for many years into the future!
Enjoy!
CBODY67
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Agreed. I still drive my 2000 VW Jetta (145K miles) and and it's going strong to this day.
tbm3fan
Old Man with a Hat
I remember that when I did my car back in 2013. Luckily the bottom of the rear window sill had no rust holes but there were a few nice round holes as in a drill bit. What and why I don't know. My upholstery guy told me he used to fabricate drains for these cars back in the day. Each corner got a drain hose that ran down into the trunk and out behind the wheel. Ok, inventive. When I cleaned up the area and got the car painted I then filled the entire area with 3M Bedding compound level to the top of the window and dutchman panel before installing the trim. Took a lot but there would be no way for any water to ever sit in there again. Of course the car doesn't see water so kind of academic at least under my ownership. The underside is definitely not painted so squirmed under and I hit that with a rust converter and then encapsulator paint.
73Coupe
Senior Member
The drains are a good idea. My Chevy has drains at the front windshield like those pictured below.
A better option would be to solder in a 1/4" brass nipple at the low point, then attach a hose on the underside.
That is what I did to my 71 Cuda, back in 1988 during a full restoration. After fixing the rust, I brazed in brass drains in each corner to the trunk before the car was painted and the window reinstalled, routing hoses to convenient body plugs. Worked like the bizzness. It was fun to wash the car and see it "pee-pee" under the trunk.
For my car now, I blast under the window trim area with this stuff every month or two. After it "soaks" for awhile, I wipe away what can be seen (doesn't hurt paint but it is oily, of course). After a drive, some more of it blows out and I wipe that away too.
And I never get the car wet, which helps. If it does get wet, I blow it dry ASAP.
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Since I am now at this step in the restoration process of my rear window frame, I am strongly considering to add drain hole(s) myself. Especially since I want the car to be "rain proof".
Two questions pop up:
- Shouldn't the drain hole best be in the middle since that is the lowest point of the window frame, giving the additional advantage that only one hole needs to be drilled?
- I do not have any experience with soldering sheet metal. The only soldering I am used to doing, is wiring.
Is that the same? Can I use the same tool, tin and technique for this job?
Question 1: That’s a judgment call between you and the God of Gravity.
Question 2: Soldering, no. Brazing, yes. You can easily and cheaply find someone to do this for you. Body shop, plumber, welder, etc.
Question 2: Soldering, no. Brazing, yes. You can easily and cheaply find someone to do this for you. Body shop, plumber, welder, etc.
Technically, you COULD do this with a 1 inch long threaded brass nipple (1/8 NPT) and a flange screwed onto that nipple, and that flange J-B WELDed to your drilled hole under the window frame. This would be after everything is repaired, prepared and fully painted for rustproofing, including inside the trunk at the window frame area at your hole(s).
To hold the nipple/flange assembly to your drilled hole (to defy that Gravity mentioned above!) you'd put a long screw up through assembly, goop the flange with the epoxy, insert in hole, and then run a nut down the screw to hold it all in place for 24 hours. Maybe use a wingnut, with a big washer, and maybe some cardboard to protect your new paint. If some epoxy oozes to block your drain, a drill bit would solve that in a jiff once the goop is cured.
Total cost would be about $10.
To hold the nipple/flange assembly to your drilled hole (to defy that Gravity mentioned above!) you'd put a long screw up through assembly, goop the flange with the epoxy, insert in hole, and then run a nut down the screw to hold it all in place for 24 hours. Maybe use a wingnut, with a big washer, and maybe some cardboard to protect your new paint. If some epoxy oozes to block your drain, a drill bit would solve that in a jiff once the goop is cured.
Total cost would be about $10.
The advantage is that the steel that you've worked so hard to repair is now totally isolated from water, including the internal surface of the hole in the window frame. This would be the case if you go with the epoxy method. You simply "glue" that nipple/flange to the cured paint on the underside of the frame.
If you go with a brazed method, obviously the painting would happen after the brazing, as the heat from the torch is not so good for paint......
If you go with a brazed method, obviously the painting would happen after the brazing, as the heat from the torch is not so good for paint......
Sorry to dig up this old topic but I'm looking for information about the rear window rust, repair and installation.
Does that quote above means that there was no molded gasket on the rear window of the Fuselage cars ?
EDIT : From what I gathered in other threads, it is indeed a butyl ribbon which is used on both windshield and rear window for Fuselage cars.
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Yes, the windshield and backlight are "glued in", as per page 23-65 in the 1970 Chrysler service manual:
"The windshield and rear windows are polysulfide adhesive sealed (cemented-in) types. Service procedures for the two glass are comparable."
"The windshield and rear windows are polysulfide adhesive sealed (cemented-in) types. Service procedures for the two glass are comparable."
Correct. Rubber gaskets ceased in 68. Fuseys and Formals used Butyl tape.
rapidtrans
Senior Member
Impalas were notorious for this problem. My Grandfather had three Impales through the sixties that developed leaks at the rear window within a couple years. This particularly annoyed him being a Chevy retiree and, being snowbirds, they lived out of their trunk while visiting up north summers. Every new Mopar Dad had, Grandpa would check-out the rear window trim detail.
On the 69 F3 rolled buytl was used to install rear window after repairing the rust damage and new top installed..
Urethane caulking finished the sealing process after pounding down the glass into the channel.
Urethane caulking finished the sealing process after pounding down the glass into the channel.
On Maggie's car,typical Fusey unpainted roof and poor drainage.
Luckily we caught it in time before it got worse.
Luckily we caught it in time before it got worse.
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