Where to look 440 short block.

[Cazman]

The stock appearing 520" in my 68 Sport Fury has HP exhaust manifolds with a little work to them, 906 heads with what I will refer to as a mid-range port etc. job and a factory steel intake and it runs on pump gas and has run a 13.45 1/4 mile @ 4,550 lbs, a 3.73 rear gear and G70-15 bias ply tires.

FURYGT - I am going to pull my 440 this winter for a build. I want to do exactly what you seem to have done. Stock looking stroker. Can you give any more details on your build? Exhaust manifolds with a little work; what kind of work? Cam details? Pistons? Compression ratio?
I have been hesitant to use my 906 heads because of lack of quench.

 

[Big_John]

Hmmm. I have a couple of MSD boxes left over from a BMW M10 race engine. Lots of rev limiter chips. I never thought of using one on an Imperial engine.

Probably won’t, because I want stock-ish appearing too. But food for thought.

You can hide it under the battery tray or on the firewall inside the car. I was always going to hollow out the windshield washer bottle on my A12 Roadrunner and mount it inside, but nobody ever noticed it mounted down low on the inner fender.

 

[furious70]

I'm all about spending way too much time and money on something than you need to (TT, OD, EFI proves that if nothing else) but it's not clear what your goals are other than to say you have a stealthy looking stroker. If that is the goal, no judgement from me, just be clear about it. I personally can't see spending 7,10,12k on an engine and not let it make some serious steam. Otherwise just put a little more gear in it, or a 4.10 and a gear vendors. Will be much cheaper and maybe as satisfying.

 

[bajajoaquin]

A gear vendors is $2500. Why not spend that money on torque instead?

 

[furious70]

Torque multiplication, use math to get the thrill.
A stroker is going to cost more than 10k since it sounds like he's got no parts and will do none of the work.

 

[MEV]

Torque multiplication, use math to get the thrill.
A stroker is going to cost more than 10k since it sounds like he's got no parts and will do none of the work.

My 66 new yorker 505/512 stroker did not cost anywhere near 10K and it runs 12.20's@109, is daily driven, runs on pump gas, and looks stock with 440 source aluminum heads. The car now has headers, but has ran 12.80's with stock log style exhaust manifolds.

Here is a video of it running 12.60 after an 70 mile drive to the track, and bolting on drag radials in the parking lot

 

[furious70]

You should line out what parts you already had, what you bought new, used, and what work you did yourself, and the costs.

 

[Cazman]

As far as my goals, they are the same as FuryGT:

runs on pump gas and has run a 13.45 1/4 mile @ 4,550 lbs, a 3.73 rear gear and G70-15 bias ply tires.

I like MEV running in 12s too! The point of the stroker is to get serious HP and still have a nice idle and steet manners. I do like the idea of the Gear Vendor too. Has anyone here installed one?

I will be building my motor myself. I am not sure what shape the block is in yet, but assuming that I am going .030 over (that means new pistons), the extra cost for a stroker is Rods and Crank. So, maybe an extra $1,500.

 

[MEV]

I am running 3.23 rear gears, so no need for a gear vendors unit. I wish i could still run the 2.76 it had stock, but no one makes a coarse spline 1350 size yoke. I would be happy to share my exact setup.

My car has been in the family since new, my great, great grandfather bought in new in june of '66, so i started with an original, running 1966 440 car.

 

[Cazman]

MEV, please share your set up.

 

[Turboomni]

That's alot of torque to push that much weight with that gear ratio. Well done MEV.

 

[70bigblockdodge]

4 tenths from headers still with 3.23.
Any you naysayers say headers don't work.

 

[moper]

Thanks your in Conn so maybe you could point me to a good machinist in the area too? I used to use Hess Machine and Balancing years ago in Fitchburg MA. He sold his business and became a head engine builder for a Red Bull air racing team. Maybe you know him? He builds aircraft engines in Belmont MA now I believe.

I am a builder myself so I only pay for machining. In terms of machining I use a couple places. One is high price point and I would recommend him to anyone looking for high quality work. But - he's expensive and if he's doing the entire build, he takes more time than I feel is appropriate so don't tell him "I'm in no rush". That's Gary at Larry's Auto Machine in Groton. The other is a personal friend and I feel I need to manage what he does for me, so I will keep that one to myself.
I don't have the experience with much in MA - last time I was involved (from the sidelines) on one was years ago (like 15+) and Paul Kraus did it. I wasn't happy with his parts choices and the engine almost killed the owner on it's first full pass when it drove over the used fueler crank he went with at the 1000' mark. So I can't help you up north.
Not sure who GT uses and I haven't read the other 2 pages of the thread, but he's had a bit done so I'd listen to what he's offering. I can tell you is stock appearing high power is what you want, you will need the best machining and head work, and the critical part is the camshaft. The one I'm most familiar with for FAST work and some of my customers is Dwayne Porter at Porter Racing Heads in VT. He's probably a 1-2+hr drive from you depending on where you are, but he would be another choice I'm comfortable in giving.

 

[moper]

I'll add - the last stoker I did is in an E body, but in it's initial form the car won it's stock appearing class at Carlisle with factory manifolds and full stock exhaust, and made 450hp to the tires. That's a 496", B wedge based build. At the track it runs in the 12s at 117, with 3.23s and being driven to and from the track (western CT to LVD). He has since swapped in headers and performance exhaust, and it's got a 4sp now and I don't think it's been back to the track but the changes made another 40hp on the same dyno. That's Duane's camshaft in it.

 

[MEV]

MEV, please share your set up.

440 .030 over (bored in the garage with a 40 year old bolt-on portable boring machine, no torque plates or anything)

440 source 505/512 stroker kit

stealth heads (bought the regular stealths and went 12.60's, later had them CNC'd at modern cylinderhead)

440 source 1.5 roller rockers and shafts (fit under stock valve covers, but added 440 source fabbed aluminum valve covers to stop leaks)

Chris straub custom hydraulic roller cam @.050 234 244 Lift .573 .563 (I initially used the comp XR280HR, hydraulic roller a tons of bottom end and mid-range and a strong top-end (but all done by 5600 RPM) I did have a premature hydraulic lifter failure and comp flipped me the bird so i went with straub technologies, and used their morel brand lifters. It is WAY better than the comp stick and lifters. It has more bottom end, more midrange, and it is absolutely fierce on the top-end, and the vacuum brakes work great)

TTI c-body full exhaust with cross-over pipe (originally had log style exhaust manifolds went 12.80's)

Performer RPM manifold

Quick Fuel SS830 carb (electric choke, mechanical secondaries) 1/4" phenolic spacer

melling high pressure, stock volume oil pump

Holley mechanical fuel pump stock 5/16" fuel line

No-name 2800 stall converter

Detroit locker with 3.23 gears, stock axles, green bearing conversion, m&h 275/60/15 drag radials

 

[Cazman]

Thanks MEV. That is similar to what I am thinking. Thanks for the cam recommendation, that is great.

My only dilemma is if I can use the stock 906 heads with some porting. I am thinking not. There just seems no way to get any quench with the selection of pistons out there. Without the quench, the CR has to be down low - I think.

Which pistons did you use?

 

[moper]

If you want to use open chamber heads - ignore trying to build for quench. Lower the static a little (I'd say around 9:1, no higher than 9.5:1 - you don't really need it anyway) and work with the pistons you can get. Thig is, 906 heads won't move enough air - so you have to redo them for performance duty, and prt them. By the time you're done you're within a few hundred bucks of a set of Stealths. Stock stealths won't make as much steam, but they are head-and-shoulders above factory iron. Plus lighter and you can build with quench in mind.

 

[MEV]

Thanks MEV. That is similar to what I am thinking. Thanks for the cam recommendation, that is great.

My only dilemma is if I can use the stock 906 heads with some porting. I am thinking not. There just seems no way to get any quench with the selection of pistons out there. Without the quench, the CR has to be down low - I think.

Which pistons did you use?

I used whatever pistons they recommended when I called them.

I had a nice set of iron heads, but there was no way I could have them rebuilt for the price of the aluminum stealths, plus with the aluminum heads I am running 10.2-ish compression, never decked the block or shaved the heads, and it does not ping on 91 pump premium.
No way you could ever get iron heads to not ping on pump premium at that compression.

I did run them stock for a while, and they were awesom, but I had a little extra mad-money laying around and sent them to modern cylinder head for their cnc job. (they are who does the CNC stealths for 440 source any way.)

 

[Turboomni]

I had a nice set of iron heads, but there was no way I could have them rebuilt for the price of the aluminum stealths, plus with the aluminum heads I am running 10.2-ish compression, never decked the block or shaved the heads, and it does not ping on 91 pump premium.
No way you could ever get iron heads to not ping on pump premium at that compression.

Good point on the detonation resistence of aluminum heads over iron. Which aluminum heads look stock, the 440 source heads did someone say?

 

[furious70]

Yes the source heads are the choice if you want it to look oem