'66 t&c

SF-66TC said:
Cbarge - see answere below -

What intake are you running??
Stock 4bbl intake (originally a 2bbl, dad upgraded in the ''70's)
Did you block the heat crossover??
Unknown - I doubt he would have...how to tell?
Original 1966 casting heads??
As far as I know, original heads - car only has 66k orig. miles
Single or dual exhaust??
Single Exhaust
At what RPM does the mechanical advance is "all in"??
My tach wasn't working at the time, but I"m guessing 2500-3000 rpm. I have a new tach, but gotta finish up suspension before I can check again.

If you can provide me a list of things to try/check i'll do them when suspension is done. - Thanks for the feedback!
Click to expand...
What year is the intake?? I tossed the 66 4bbl intake for a 68-70 casting.Had a slight rise and flows much better than the 66 4bbl casting.
You can opt for an aluminum Edelbrock intake if you so desire.
To know if the cross over is blocked or not you can check the temp with a laser heat gun between the carb and head where the crossover is located.-or pull the intake.
The reason to block the crossover is to keep the heat away from the gas. The 383 I worked on had a problem with gas boiling and evaporating before it got a chance to burn and that caused ping from a lean-out condition.
If you do not want to pull the intake,at least add a 1/2 inch spacer under the carb to isolate it from the heat.
The original closed combustion chamber heads have small valves and do not flow as well as later 906 or 452 casting heads. Detonation can hurt your heads and may burn a valve or two in extreme cases.
I found burnt valves on the 66 383 and ended up replacing the heads with a rebuilt set of 1976 452 casting heads.They already had hardened valve seats and port matched..
I ran the single exhaust for one year and then installed the TTI dual system.
What a difference..Engine temps went down,MPG went up.I had to rejet the carb and different size metering rods to give her More gas to fix another lean-out condition from the free flowing exhaust.

Running Pertronix I,initial timing set at 11.5 degrees,full advance at 34 degrees at 2400 RPM with vacuum advance NOT hooked up. Engine was retarted which caused engine to heat up and ping.

In conclusion,I had to isolate heat from the fuel system,reduce engine temps,add more fuel and increase air flow to eliminate any ping.
Hope this helps.
 
cbarge said:
What year is the intake?? I tossed the 66 4bbl intake for a 68-70 casting.Had a slight rise and flows much better than the 66 4bbl casting.
You can opt for an aluminum Edelbrock intake if you so desire.
To know if the cross over is blocked or not you can check the temp with a laser heat gun between the carb and head where the crossover is located.-or pull the intake.
The reason to block the crossover is to keep the heat away from the gas. The 383 I worked on had a problem with gas boiling and evaporating before it got a chance to burn and that caused ping from a lean-out condition.
If you do not want to pull the intake,at least add a 1/2 inch spacer under the carb to isolate it from the heat.
The original closed combustion chamber heads have small valves and do not flow as well as later 906 or 452 casting heads. Detonation can hurt your heads and may burn a valve or two in extreme cases.
I found burnt valves on the 66 383 and ended up replacing the heads with a rebuilt set of 1976 452 casting heads.They already had hardened valve seats and port matched..
I ran the single exhaust for one year and then installed the TTI dual system.
What a difference..Engine temps went down,MPG went up.I had to rejet the carb and different size metering rods to give her More gas to fix another lean-out condition from the free flowing exhaust.

Running Pertronix I,initial timing set at 11.5 degrees,full advance at 34 degrees at 2400 RPM with vacuum advance NOT hooked up. Engine was retarted which caused engine to heat up and ping.

In conclusion,I had to isolate heat from the fuel system,reduce engine temps,add more fuel and increase air flow to eliminate any ping.
Hope this helps.
Click to expand...

cbarge, You stated to check the temp between carb and heads... intake manifold - Where exactly should I be pointing the laser heat gun and what temp should I be looking for? If the temp is high, can you suggest where to source the 1/2" spacer?

hmmm... replace the heads? too much work for the amount I drive her. Was thinking about TTI dual exhaust, but that would mean getting different exhaust manifolds just to have them since I have the log type.
 
SF-66TC said:
cbarge, You stated to check the temp between carb and heads... intake manifold - Where exactly should I be pointing the laser heat gun and what temp should I be looking for? If the temp is high, can you suggest where to source the 1/2" spacer?

hmmm... replace the heads? too much work for the amount I drive her. Was thinking about TTI dual exhaust, but that would mean getting different exhaust manifolds just to have them since I have the log type.
Click to expand...
Point the laser at the intake under the carb where the heat crossover port is located.When not blocked the gun can read 250-350 degrees.The carb can be equally as hot.Not good for the fuel.
When blocked and a spacer under the carb,pointing the gun at the base of carb temp should read 106 degrees when the engine is at temp (I pointed the laser at the thermostat housing and it read 195!!)
The carb spacer I ordered from Summit Racing. Edelbrock #8723
It has the dual bolt pattern that fits all sizes of intakes/carbs
While you are at it,get some heat sheathing for the fuel line as well.
Cover the line from the fuel filter to the carb. The line should not be touching the right valve cover to avoid any heat absorption.

Heads were just an optimum recommendation pertaining to your detonation concern.
A lower cost alternative is pull the heads and de-carbon the top of the pistons and the heads.
If there is a heavy build up of carbon on the pistons,all the fine tuning in the world will not get rid of the ping.
Today's quality of fuel is a far cry from what the car was designed for when new.
No need to change the log manifolds.The 66 300 is running factory Lo-po logs with the TTi system.When placing your order,they ask for the casting numbers from your logs and the pipes bolt on.
Hope this helps
 
Last edited:
cbarge said:
What year is the intake?? I tossed the 66 4bbl intake for a 68-70 casting.Had a slight rise and flows much better than the 66 4bbl casting.
You can opt for an aluminum Edelbrock intake if you so desire.
To know if the cross over is blocked or not you can check the temp with a laser heat gun between the carb and head where the crossover is located.-or pull the intake.
The reason to block the crossover is to keep the heat away from the gas. The 383 I worked on had a problem with gas boiling and evaporating before it got a chance to burn and that caused ping from a lean-out condition.
If you do not want to pull the intake,at least add a 1/2 inch spacer under the carb to isolate it from the heat.
The original closed combustion chamber heads have small valves and do not flow as well as later 906 or 452 casting heads. Detonation can hurt your heads and may burn a valve or two in extreme cases.
I found burnt valves on the 66 383 and ended up replacing the heads with a rebuilt set of 1976 452 casting heads.They already had hardened valve seats and port matched..
I ran the single exhaust for one year and then installed the TTI dual system.
What a difference..Engine temps went down,MPG went up.I had to rejet the carb and different size metering rods to give her More gas to fix another lean-out condition from the free flowing exhaust.

Running Pertronix I,initial timing set at 11.5 degrees,full advance at 34 degrees at 2400 RPM with vacuum advance NOT hooked up. Engine was retarted which caused engine to heat up and ping.

In conclusion,I had to isolate heat from the fuel system,reduce engine temps,add more fuel and increase air flow to eliminate any ping.
Hope this helps.
Click to expand...

Intake Casting number is 2205968 which is a 383-4 62-67
cbarge said:
Point the laser at the intake under the carb where the heat crossover port is located.When not blocked the gun can read 250-350 degrees.The carb can be equally as hot.Not good for the fuel.
When blocked and a spacer under the carb,pointing the gun at the base of carb temp should read 106 degrees when the engine is at temp (I pointed the laser at the thermostat housing and it read 195!!)
The carb spacer I ordered from Summit Racing. Edelbrock #8723
It has the dual bolt pattern that fits all sizes of intakes/carbs
While you are at it,get some heat sheathing for the fuel line as well.
Cover the line from the fuel filter to the carb. The line should not be touching the right valve cover to avoid any heat absorption.

Heads were just an optimum recommendation pertaining to your detonation concern.
A lower cost alternative is pull the heads and de-carbon the top of the pistons and the heads.
If there is a heavy build up of carbon on the pistons,all the fine tuning in the world will not get rid of the ping.
Today's quality of fuel is a far cry from what the car was designed for when new.
No need to change the log manifolds.The 66 300 is running factory Lo-po logs with the TTi system.When placing your order,they ask for the casting numbers from your logs and the pipes bolt on.
Hope this helps
Click to expand...

cbarge. thanks for all the tips!

Did you install the TTi system yourself?
Did you need to get the Torque Shaft Assembly?
Any problems with the installation?

The intake is a 2205968 which makes is a 383-4 '62-'67
Mopar Casting Numbers - MyMopar.com - Mopar Part Numners
2015-11-11%2010_opt.jpg


When I rebuilt the carter carb I ran a new fuel line to the filter and I did keep it from touching the valve cover by about an inch.
I'll need to test the temp with the laser gun to check whether the heat crossover port is blocked.... after I finish my suspension.
2015-11-14%2012.58.44.jpg
 
I had installed 2 TTi systems without any issues.
Third system to be installed soon.
The Lo-po logs do not require the torque shaft assembly.
Disconnect the battery and follow the instructions to the T.
Nothing wrong with your intake manifold--just that there are better ones out there.
Should you block the heat crossover,use an electric choke. The "factory choke relies on the heat from the crossover to function.
Not much out there for the "small" bolt pattern style of the carb flange.
The carb spacer will give the engine a better charge along with the reduced fuel temps. Why did Ma put looonng runners on the slant six or the Cross Ram engines?? To make better torque at low RPM. Same principle with the spacer.
I forgot to mention no mods needed to the throttle bracket and cable.Do a road test and double check your kickdown linkage. Adjust if needed.
 
rags said:
cbarge, gotta hand it to you. your replies here are some of the best mechanical recommendations i've read on this site. well done. SG
Click to expand...
Thanks.I speak from experience. Started working on the 66 300 April 2013.The past two summers I learned what did and did not work for that car.
It took me that long to work out the bugs and remedy all of its "historical issues" lol.
This summer her owner and I can jump in,turn the key and drive anywhere.
 
many try
cbarge said:
Thanks.I speak from experience. Started working on the 66 300 April 2013.The past two summers I learned what did and did not work for that car.
It took me that long to work out the bugs and remedy all of its "historical issues" lol.
This summer her owner and I can jump in,turn the key and drive anywhere.
Click to expand...
many try. few succeed. i've read some well intentioned yet less than useful stuff here. you hit every nail on the head. congrats, SG
 
cbarge said:
I had installed 2 TTi systems without any issues.
Third system to be installed soon.
The Lo-po logs do not require the torque shaft assembly.
Disconnect the battery and follow the instructions to the T.
Nothing wrong with your intake manifold--just that there are better ones out there.
Should you block the heat crossover,use an electric choke. The "factory choke relies on the heat from the crossover to function.
Not much out there for the "small" bolt pattern style of the carb flange.
The carb spacer will give the engine a better charge along with the reduced fuel temps. Why did Ma put looonng runners on the slant six or the Cross Ram engines?? To make better torque at low RPM. Same principle with the spacer.
I forgot to mention no mods needed to the throttle bracket and cable.Do a road test and double check your kickdown linkage. Adjust if needed.
Click to expand...

cbarge - regarding converting my factory choke over to electric, I'm assuming the arm going into the manifold is the factory choke. Any idea how I would convert this over to electric. According to what I've googled, the electric choke mechanism would attach to the side of the carb, but I don't see where I could do this. The carb is a Carter 3611S or a C-4 AFB
2015-07-18%2016_opt.jpg
 
cbarge said:
What year is the intake?? I tossed the 66 4bbl intake for a 68-70 casting.Had a slight rise and flows much better than the 66 4bbl casting.
You can opt for an aluminum Edelbrock intake if you so desire.
To know if the cross over is blocked or not you can check the temp with a laser heat gun between the carb and head where the crossover is located.-or pull the intake.
The reason to block the crossover is to keep the heat away from the gas. The 383 I worked on had a problem with gas boiling and evaporating before it got a chance to burn and that caused ping from a lean-out condition.
If you do not want to pull the intake,at least add a 1/2 inch spacer under the carb to isolate it from the heat.
The original closed combustion chamber heads have small valves and do not flow as well as later 906 or 452 casting heads. Detonation can hurt your heads and may burn a valve or two in extreme cases.
I found burnt valves on the 66 383 and ended up replacing the heads with a rebuilt set of 1976 452 casting heads.They already had hardened valve seats and port matched..
I ran the single exhaust for one year and then installed the TTI dual system.
What a difference..Engine temps went down,MPG went up.I had to rejet the carb and different size metering rods to give her More gas to fix another lean-out condition from the free flowing exhaust.

Running Pertronix I,initial timing set at 11.5 degrees,full advance at 34 degrees at 2400 RPM with vacuum advance NOT hooked up. Engine was retarted which caused engine to heat up and ping.

In conclusion,I had to isolate heat from the fuel system,reduce engine temps,add more fuel and increase air flow to eliminate any ping.
Hope this helps.
Click to expand...

damn son.
you just fixed half of everybody.
I know I lived through exactly this, the hard way.

the only thing I can add is when you buy a fel pro valley pan gasket, get the one with the blocked crossovers/heat risers.

try not to die -

- saylor
 
66tc - I dunno how cold it is out in san Francisco, but here in dfw I only need the choke when cold starting it from an overnight sit or whatever. if you do a manual choke on a wire its cheap to do.
 
saylor said:
damn son.
you just fixed half of everybody.
I know I lived through exactly this, the hard way.

the only thing I can add is when you buy a fel pro valley pan gasket, get the one with the blocked crossovers/heat risers.

try not to die -

- saylor
Click to expand...

Thanks Saylor - If I do decide to pull the manifold I'll get that fel pro valley pan gasket from Summit - http://www.summitracing.com/parts/fel-1214/overview/

My dad also had some tin foil under the intake. I'm assuming it was to replace this? Big Block Intake Manifold Insulation Dodge Plymouth Mopar

2014-11-29%2015.26.09.jpg
 
saylor said:
66tc - I dunno how cold it is out in san Francisco, but here in dfw I only need the choke when cold starting it from an overnight sit or whatever. if you do a manual choke on a wire its cheap to do.
Click to expand...

Sounds like a plan Saylor! It's not very cold here in SF... average mid 50's. Car is garaged so starting wouldn't be much of a problem and a manual choke would be an easy setup.
 
cbarge said:
What year is the intake?? I tossed the 66 4bbl intake for a 68-70 casting.Had a slight rise and flows much better than the 66 4bbl casting.
You can opt for an aluminum Edelbrock intake if you so desire.
To know if the cross over is blocked or not you can check the temp with a laser heat gun between the carb and head where the crossover is located.-or pull the intake.
The reason to block the crossover is to keep the heat away from the gas. The 383 I worked on had a problem with gas boiling and evaporating before it got a chance to burn and that caused ping from a lean-out condition.
If you do not want to pull the intake,at least add a 1/2 inch spacer under the carb to isolate it from the heat.
The original closed combustion chamber heads have small valves and do not flow as well as later 906 or 452 casting heads. Detonation can hurt your heads and may burn a valve or two in extreme cases.
I found burnt valves on the 66 383 and ended up replacing the heads with a rebuilt set of 1976 452 casting heads.They already had hardened valve seats and port matched..
I ran the single exhaust for one year and then installed the TTI dual system.
What a difference..Engine temps went down,MPG went up.I had to rejet the carb and different size metering rods to give her More gas to fix another lean-out condition from the free flowing exhaust.

Running Pertronix I,initial timing set at 11.5 degrees,full advance at 34 degrees at 2400 RPM with vacuum advance NOT hooked up. Engine was retarted which caused engine to heat up and ping.

In conclusion,I had to isolate heat from the fuel system,reduce engine temps,add more fuel and increase air flow to eliminate any ping.
Hope this helps.
Click to expand...

cbarge, do you recall the size jets and metering rods you replaced when adding the dual exhaust?
 
Edelbrock 625 CFM carb...Trying to remember..but not 100% sure...038 to .040 or went from.040 to.044 jets,and cannot remember the size of metering rods but they were one size fatter from stock.
Hope this helps
 
Last edited:
SF-66TC said:
Sounds like a plan Saylor! It's not very cold here in SF... average mid 50's. Car is garaged so starting wouldn't be much of a problem and a manual choke would be an easy setup.
Click to expand...
With your carb,manual choke is the way to go.
 
just watch the linkage around the breather make sure the linkage has full travel moving the carb plate full open and doesnt hit the bottom of the filter housing when you use the choke. you dont want to be drivin around with a 3/4 open carb.
 
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