Pulley alignment issue

Cazman

Cazman

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Seems like all the small stuff is keeping me from finishing this stroker. I have a 440 Source crank and a 440 Source harmonic balancer. My problem is that my main pulley to water pump pulley alignment is off about 3/8". Its the stock water pump. The balancer is on all the way (double checked), but it acts like it need to go in further.

So, I found my old stock balancer in my junk pile and put it on - better, but still off 1/4". Picture below. If I use a straight edge between my alternator pulley and the water pump pulley, they are right on, so its the main pulley. Any suggestions?

IMG_0910.jpeg
 
There wasn’t one originally. If I do that then I have to bring the alternator pulley out too.
 
I know a few members here have used 440 Source cranks. Maybe this is something that is normal and has to be shimmed.
 
I had to shim out the water pump pulley when I replaced it on my car. That was 1/16" though and not 1/4- 3/8.

I'm wondering if the 440 source crank is a little long...

I would measure the length of the balancer and then the distance from the end of the crank snout to the shoulder that the balancer would bottom out against.

Should be able to do that with a digital/dial/vernier caliper depth rod.
 
Did all that. Everything checks out. The 440 Source one does put the pulley out a bit farther, but that's not the main problem. I think that you are right, the crank has to be the source.
 
The water pump flange is a press fit on the shaft so you have a certain amount of leeway as far as the position. 3/8" would be a stretch though. Too late now but I would have used an OEM forged crank as opposed to the 440 Source which is a Chinese import.

Another option would be to find another crank pulley of different height. Research required to find what would work.
 
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Were these pulleys on the engine before the build?

I think a call to 440 source might be in order. They have had to go through this before and have a solution or work around.
 
Almost all the accessories are stock, just as I pulled them off. I talked to 440 Source last week and no new info from them. They say it should work.
I went down to my machinist and he had another 440 come in that was still put together. I measured the distance from the timing gear to the end of the crank snout and it is the same. The dimensions of the balancer are the same too!

Very weird. The only other variable are the water pump gaskets. They must be thin. I'll just shim now, as everything seem to be in order.
 
Is the water pump new? That's where I would put suspect. If you put the alternator on what pulleys does it line up with? Then the odd one is problem.
Just some thoughts.
 
70bigblockdodge said:
Is the water pump new? That's where I would put suspect. If you put the alternator on what pulleys does it line up with? Then the odd one is problem.
Just some thoughts.
Click to expand...

Old Water pump, rebuilt alternator. Those two pulleys line up. The crank pulley does not. That is why this has been so odd. I am going to have to shim everything to match the new crank pulley position.
 
So, I needed a new water pump anyway and ordered Milodon. Hoping that maybe something might change my alignment. It is the same. Actually worse, because there is not as much shaft protruding so shims won't work (probably shouldn't shim this much anyway).

At a loss. 440 Source says all my dimensions check out. Still need my crank pulley to move in 3/8".
 
Cazman said:
So, I needed a new water pump anyway and ordered Milodon. Hoping that maybe something might change my alignment. It is the same. Actually worse, because there is not as much shaft protruding so shims won't work (probably shouldn't shim this much anyway).

At a loss. 440 Source says all my dimensions check out. Still need my crank pulley to move in 3/8".
Click to expand...
IIRC, the balancer bottoms out on the crankshaft. I'm thinking that this section of crank is too long (yellow arrow) but the length of the end is correct. Bet if this crank was sitting next to a stock one, it would be 3/8 longer.

Crank.jpg


But, the engine is together and I don't think you want to pull it apart.

Perhaps the way to do this would be to trim 3/8" off the balancer so it can be pushed in farther. A spacer would have to be made to go behind the bolt/washer to push it down, past flush. I'm not sure I like this idea though...

The other thought I'm having is to source another crank pulley that has a groove inboard of the existing one and shim it the 1/8" or so to make it work. That might be the simpler way. There may be some other options here that may work.

I assume you have a power steering pump. Are you running A/C too?
 
The damper to crank snout is a special tapered interference fit. With an aftermarket damper or new unknown crank you must verify full proper engagement and if not to spec then fit accordingly. I strongly suspect you are not getting full insertion of the damper. If this is the case then the crank must come out. If this is not the case you could section the pulley & weld.

On second thought the crank might not have to come out. The damper could be honed out to proper spec, I would have the machine shop do this if you trust them. I had this done once before on a stroker motor, the damper was too tight.
 
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Big_John said:
I respectfully disagree that it's a tapered fit. It is a press fit, but it is not tapered.
Click to expand...
The damper goes on loosely about a 3rd of the way before running into interference, I call that tapered, you may call it otherwise.
 
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