Why was the BF109 so slow compared with the P51?
- Thread starter Turboomni
- Start date
chaparral2f
Active Member
The P-51 was 7 years newer and by the time the 2 aircraft met in combat the Bf109G was having to add more and more weapons to be able to do damage to the B-17s and B-24s coming over Germany. This made them much heavier than what it was originally designed for.
Also by then, most of the more skilled pilots in the Luftwaffe were either dead or captured, in addition the Me-262, the worlds first jet aircraft, was repeatedly delayed because Hitler wanted to use it as a bomber. Had it been introduced in early 1943 when it could have been produced in mass numbers, the air war in Europe might have had a very different outcome. As it was the allies were sustaining about 40% casualties to the bomber forces penetrating deep into Germany without fighter escort prior to the introduction of the P-51 in 1944. The P-51 quickly established air superiority for the Allies against the older German fighters. By the time the Me-262 was operational in late 1944, it was too late. There is a good book which covers some of this: Adolph Galland "The First and the Last".
Dave
Dave
Yes and no,,the displacement was SMALLER in the Mustang than the 109,,Fuel had alot also to do with it, the 109 was smaller and lighter than the 51 also and both supercharged,,so I suggest you watch the video. Superchargers were much different in the Mustang with dual superchargers...watch the video. If you like data watch the video.
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yes we know the ending Why?? Watch the video
Faster in level flight, better turning radius, better climb rate, better dive profile, lower stall speed, how else could it end.
Dave
No reason to be sorry, it was a very interesting video. You may be aware that the P-51A and P51B had a less than auspicious debut, they had the Allison engine with a single stage supercharger and performed poorly at higher altitudes.. The C&D models were retro fitted with the Rolls Royce Merlin engine with an improved dual supercharger that made the aircraft all but unbeatable against the older German fighter.
Dave
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Knebel
Senior Member
you guys ever seen a british spitfire? when I was a kid, my dad took me to an airshow and one of those flew over us in mindboggling speed and created a rumbling thunder that made my bones shake. Granted, as a kid i probably experienced this differently but I do remember being in complete Aweee about this. those old planes are fascinating.
jct
Senior Member
Nothing sounds greater than piston driven vintage warbirds
The Goose
Senior Member
I took a few start up vids in Camarillo a while back. They’re short but pretty cool. I’ll see if I can find em. P51 - zero - hell cat - jug - etc. I was pretty close. Funny & cool how much they smoke. I always try to remember & admire those guys on how they flew these old tech monsters over hundreds of miles of ocean or enemy filled territory. Brass Balls no cellphone required.
Fratzog
Old Man with a Hat
Likely a more formidable adversary for the Mustang was the FW190.
Hans Dortenmann--The Luftwaffe's Highest Scoring Focke Wulf FW-190D Ace
Hans Dortenmann--The Luftwaffe's Highest Scoring Focke Wulf FW-190D Ace
jct
Senior Member
Must have great and blissful, with your squadron mates telling stories over the radio
Old Mike
Well-Known Member
You can also go to google or bing and pull up some cool engine run videos. Allison 1710s, Packard Merlin’s, the big Wright radials, and the big Pratt & Whitneys. A lot of them are on homemade looking stands (some look too small to handle all that torque). A couple even have props on them. The guys running them are all having a great time, of course standing around these monsters and the engines sound terrific.
fury fan
Senior Member
Not to hijack, but must report:
Aluminum Overcast, one of the last (?) airworthy B17s, has made several tour stops at a local muni airport about 10 min from me. I never knew what it was, why it was there, etc, to find out where it would come from. I'd hear it on a weekend afternoon, see it above/between the trees ever so briefly, just enough to ID it, and then just hear it for a few minutes. One day, however, it logged 4 passes thru the only open pocket of view I have over the cul-de-sac.
On the last run I heard it ahead of time, ran out into the street, and saw it was heading right toward me following the street - a different flight path completely that I did not prepare for. Couldn't get my damn phone out of my pocket, past the password, and into video mode until it was past me.
But it would've been a helluva video clip - it was running at what surely must've been minimum altitude, and going very slow. Took a full 10 secs to show me its tail. As I type this, I wonder if the pilot was eagle-eyed and happened to notice a person on the ground come-a-running every time he went by??? He surely could've seen me on the last pass, at least.
I asked a pilot buddy that also lives nearby and he filled me in, he knew all about this plane. Maybe one day I'll see it in person.
I have seen that plane flying and up close. She tours around and you can ride, but ticket prices start around $450 and climb to $1,500 ish. I have some pictures (I'll look for them later) from this past summer when I caught her on the ground at Oak Island, NC. I was the only person out there that day so I got to take my time and stroll around her, but I couldn't afford a ticket.
Here is the posted tour B-17 Aluminum Overcast Tour Stops | EAA
Looks like she lives somewhere around here in NC.
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jct
Senior Member
Not the same, they have to be attached to a plane making passes
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