What viscosity and brand engine oil and filter do you prefer to use in your C-Body?

[celticwarlock]

I know this thread started a while ago, but it is still an ongoing topic to consider. The standards for motor oil have continued to change more and more formulations to less and less antiwear agents (ZDDP...) to meet with federal emission standards. Face it, in the grand scheme of things there just isn't enough market for these products and it will continue to diminish. I have been looking at and carefully considering this stuff too.
FWIW, I am a long time user of Wix filters (or NAPA gold) and have had a small number of failures over the decades. Usually on older sludgey engines where the complaint related to low pressure at stoplights, new filter always solved that issue in my experience and there is a pressure relief valve built in if the filter was immediately restricted by fresh oil cleaning up the evils. Always just warrantied them, never cut on open, and the problem never returned. I have avoided Fram since the late 80s early 90s when the cutaway displays started to show up. I suppose I will continue to use them until they prove to be lesser quality.

I hate this, but I have had a fair number of incorrectly cut threads on Wix and some other brands over the years, but at 500+ filters a year... you will find defects.

As to motor oil, I am still undecided. I heard some Rotella is still made for older engines but CJ-4 rating is lower zinc formula. Also diesel oils may not provide as much storage protection. Amsoil ZROD sounds interesting, but I am not sure I love synthetic for this application. Brad Penn is the old Kendall refinery's new label after the name was sold away, I can not swear they are still using "obsolete" oil formulations. There are several performance and classic oriented brands, but I am not a believer. I have read the claim that Mobil 1 15W50 is an older formula, but doubt it has stayed that way...

What I really want to know is... does anybody have a compelling reason for use of a brand that is based on current information? Past experience really doesn't count as more oils are rated SL, SM, SN all the time and they DO NOT contain the antiwear additives we may be looking for.

How many of you have experienced oil leaks with the change to synthetics? That is supposed to be the common issue with their use in older engine designs (rope seals). Also low viscosity can lead to lower oil pressure on older engines which have much larger clearances than newer engines. I doubt we could trace many failures directly to a newer grade of oil in a high mile engine, but it is a scary thought that your favorite classic could be sidelined by this issue.

At some point the emission liability and low demand will pretty much eliminate the availability of "flat tappet" oils and we will all be on borrowed time. Like leaded fuels, I believe there will still be lots of engines that survive, even if there are also documented failures. The best thing is to change it often enough and run it often enough... IDK if anything else is really a cure or just the placebo effect.

To answer your question regarding why certain people prefer certain oils, I use Pennzoil because it tends to hold up well in demanding engines. I drive for a living and have owned small fleets of vehicles (all sorts of sizes, makes and models and years), and what I have seen has led me to believe this. In my experience, it will resist breaking down to the point where it is "consumed" by the engine. If I have an engine that is in need of some internal cleaning, however, I will use something that (I am told) has a higher detergent content such as Castrol or Valvoline. The Lucas is for added stability, and the STP treatment is used solely as a ZDDP supplement. Is it necessary? I have no bloody idea. However, at a few bucks per bottle, why not err on the side of caution and throw it in there?

 

[cantflip]

To answer your question regarding why certain people prefer certain oils, I use Pennzoil because it tends to hold up well in demanding engines. I drive for a living and have owned small fleets of vehicles (all sorts of sizes, makes and models and years), and what I have seen has led me to believe this. In my experience, it will resist breaking down to the point where it is "consumed" by the engine. If I have an engine that is in need of some internal cleaning, however, I will use something that (I am told) has a higher detergent content such as Castrol or Valvoline. The Lucas is for added stability, and the STP treatment is used solely as a ZDDP supplement. Is it necessary? I have no bloody idea. However, at a few bucks per bottle, why not err on the side of caution and throw it in there?

I have been a bit jaded when it comes to additives... but never though of STP as a ZDDP source. Thanks... new crap to go read.

 

[1966newport]

Well kinda sorta not really.

Purolator is owned by Mann + Hummel, a German company.

MANN+HUMMEL: MANN+HUMMEL takes over Purolator filters joint venture from Bosch

Mann + Hummel purchased the Wix auto filtration unit of Affinia Group last year.

http://www.hdma.org/Main-Menu/HDMA-...Hummel-Buys-Affinias-Wix-Filtration-Unit.html

Kevin

all i know the current wix filters appear to the same as the purolator filters

 

[Big_John]

I use Brad Penn 10W-30 with a Wix/Napa Gold filter.

I use the Brad Penn because of the added ZDDP.... and my son works for an oil distributor... So I get a good deal. The filter choice comes from reading the filter study mentioned earlier in this thread. I saw that years ago and it opened my eyes.

My DD is going to get Gulf full synthetic and a Wix filter. I like the synthetic oils and I got a case cheaper than buying the cheap stuff at Wally World.

My son has been telling me that a lot of the oil you buy now has some recycled oil in it.... Including the premium oils. The advantage is the old oil needs less refining then crude and it's actually better oil once it's reprocessed. Interesting stuff...

 

[oliver]

Wix oil filter and Castrol 20W50 (she thinks it's honey) engine oil. 10W40 sometimes if it's very cold

 

[hotrodharley66]

Fram filters = GARBAGE. Any and all engine shops say absolutely DO NOT use Fram

Best Filters:
WIX, Moroso, K&N, Royal Purple, Hastings, Amsoil

Best conventional oils: (for our old cars)
Joe Gibbs, Lucas Oil, Brad Penn

Rotella is not the same anymore. Neither is GM EOS.

If you have access to the oils I listed and you care about your car I highly recommend use them.

If you insist on synthetics use: Joe Gibbs, Royal Purple, Amsoil

Modern oils like Penzoil, Mobil 1, Castrol, etc etc are meant for new cars. They do not even remotely keep 30, 40, 50 year old cars in mind when blending them. Even those so called "high mileage" oils. They are for nigh mileage newer cars.

 

[cantflip]

I use Brad Penn 10W-30 with a Wix/Napa Gold filter.

I use the Brad Penn because of the added ZDDP.... and my son works for an oil distributor... So I get a good deal. The filter choice comes from reading the filter study mentioned earlier in this thread. I saw that years ago and it opened my eyes.

My DD is going to get Gulf full synthetic and a Wix filter. I like the synthetic oils and I got a case cheaper than buying the cheap stuff at Wally World.

My son has been telling me that a lot of the oil you buy now has some recycled oil in it.... Including the premium oils. The advantage is the old oil needs less refining then crude and it's actually better oil once it's reprocessed. Interesting stuff...

Thanks Big John, I was wondering if the Brad Penn still contained ZDDP. I was a fan of Kendal products, and missed them when they went away (especially super blue grease).

As to other oils, unless you want to send samples to a lab and pay for analysis... it's hard to say what you're really getting. I can find no official source of how much ZDDP is contained in any of the oils... just regurgitated internet info from private parties. That is the issue I am having, the label doesn't clearly state how much you will get, and the emissions requirement is to eliminate it. Even in the last year, facts may have changed.

Her is my best interpretation, feel free to correct/educate me. For decades I recommended oils that had the API starburst on the back label and told folks the further down the alphabet the better. SJ rating was the last one for gas engines that related to engine protection itself. SL rating was the first that related to Catalytic Converter protection (less zinc, less catalyst contamination). CJ rating for diesel engines is the beginning of the end.

The API starburst still indicates the engine protection qualities of the oil, but also the catalyst protection qualities... and you can't protect a flat tappet cam and the catalyst with the same oil apparently (the zinc will eventually contaminate the cat). None of my flat tappet engines were equipped with a catalyst from new, if you have a mid 70's engine that has one... the damage was done a long time ago. Originally the catalyst was given a 60k mile service life, at which time you were supposed to replace the catalyst (the beads could be replaced in some of the old ones). Assuming we all care more about the longevity of our engines than emission compliance, most of us would run a quality oil that still had the right stuff to keep ours alive. My issue with this is there is so little information that is current and official from the manufacturers. I don't hate finding out a couple years later I was doing something wrong.

I will now have to watch my Wix filters for quality changes. All I care about in the oil is lasting protection and keeping the engine alive, but I also sometimes contemplate a minor cam upgrade... no point going with another flat tappet if I can't keep it alive in the future, but no desire to go through a roller conversion either. The properties of a conventional oil that I like, that may be available in some synthetics... Storage protection...short runs and lots of sitting is hard on engines/oils, and leakage with older sealing technologies. I do realize the synthetics are better stabilized for operating conditions, but I don't intend to push service intervals.

 

[Big_John]

Interestingly enough, Brad Penn oil has been bought by another company. I did a search this morning for Brad Penn and discovered that it's now Penngrade oil and owned by DA Lubricants.

DA makes DA Speed Sport oil and was always very active with Indy racing. There is no mention on their sites other than the name change and DA Lubricants name on the Penngrade site.

 

[detmatt]

Since my last post in this thread I have changed to Brad Penn for my classics.

 

[twostick]

The last new oil analysis I saw on Bob is the Oilguy shows Rotella zinc and phos to be reduced but it is still in the 1200 ppm range. Most 15/40's are in this range. More than enough for any flat tappet cam to survive.

If you are unsure, just go to your nearest truck dealer and get a sample kit and pour a new sample of what ever brand you fancy and send it in.

The kit is $20-30 and then you know.

Kevin

 

[Big_John]

My son dropped this off today. He works for an oil supplier and while they don't carry Brad Penn, he can get it for me a little cheaper than over the counter. I change oil once each summer and usually go through an additional quart. This will last two summers plus.

 

[jct]

what are your thoughts on zinc replacement additive?