1962 newport-440 big block??

62newportAZ

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ive got a newport that had a 361bb in it and took a crap on me. i dont have the money to fully rebuild it . a buddy of mine has a 440 out of a RV i just dont know if motor mounts and stuff will still work or will i have to change everything? if anyone could shed some light on this for me i would appriciate it!

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It will drop in after you change the, exhaust manifolds, oil pan & pickup and I THINK the water pump housing. If you have to, that stuff should swap over from the 361 to the MH 440.
You might want to upgrade some stuff like the radiator.
 
I'm not 100% certain of this one.

The 361 is a B engine, and the 440 an RB. I know this sounds a bit like I'm mixing apples and pears, but if someone wants to fit a 440 into a '65, then there are only certain later blocks that can be used - the ones that have two bosses on the left front like most B blocks - and they need conversion engine mounts to do it. I would assume that this would also apply to the '62's.
 
If your car was one year older you would be screwed, as they had a different crank flange, converter, starter, etc. You may need to take the torque converter with it, as the later cast crank 440's were externally balanced. You didn't give the year of the RV, but my bet is, if it is a 440 and not a 413, I'm guessing a '73-'79 which should be the cast crank.

The second issue tied to this is the '67 and older 727's had different pump spline on the input shaft. Your options may be to see if you can get a 400/440 weighted converter, maybe from Precision... (aviod B&M) Possibly they could put one together for your particular project, with the older '67 and older internal spline, and the 400/440 weights, or if you need to freshen the transmission, you may be able to have the later pump put in your trans....maybe??? Then making it possible to use the converter from the RV.

If this does happen to be an older 440 forged/steel crank, you may be able to tell by the thickness of the harmonic balancer. If it is much over an inch thick, tied with a '72 up casting date it is likely the cast unit. It would be much easier if you could find an older 440 or any '62 and up 361, 383 or 413 excluding the 361/413 truck engine.
 
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In the 40-odd years that I've been working on Mopars, I've only ever seen a weighted converter used on the early type A727. Although their may be exceptions - and knowing mopar - there will be, that means that the original converter, together with its flexplate, can be used. One thing I have seen is two different boss diameters on the converter, so it is worth checking that this is correct for the hole in the rear of the crank that it fits into.

Externally balanced engines therefore dont cause a problem in this area.

Regarding the harmonic balancer. On cast crank engines, it says "for use with cast cranks only."
 
good information, here. that's a neat looking car, man! hope to see it back on the road soon.
 
I know Uncle Joe has been working on Mopars in the 40 odd years, and I haven't been alive much over 40 years, but when I started wrenching I did it every year, not just the odd years. I also started early, before I was in school at 4-5 years old helping my Dad do mechanic work, cleaning parts, fetching tools etc. I rebuilt a '66 Dodge pickup 318 Poly with a solid cam & adjustable rockers when I was 16 completely on my own... It still ran fine when I got rid of it last year. Since I was 16 every job I had ranged from mechanic, diesel mechanic, auto body and frame up rebuilds, and not as a fetch parts, grease monkey. I've been upside down deep to my bootstrings in cars, trucks, semis, bulldozers, payloaders, tractors, combines and sterndrive boats.

My best suggestion is that you take everything in here, then confirm it by checking what torque converters are available for what engines, what years etc...and likewise with other information/parts compatability. Best this information should come from the manufacturer or a catalogue, or you may get bogus information. One boob at Mancini Racing told me that the Indy EZ heads raise the intake 2.5 inches. Concerned for hood clearance, I was looking for something accurate like .450", not "I'm a lazy puke and I want to eat another donut and finish my pop, so I'll discourage this guy, so he hangs up."

You should be able to weed through this without just giving up, as this can work. Just don't slap it together with the '62 converter with a cast crank, or down the road your cast crank will likely develop fatigue cracks and break. The weights on the torque converters or the holes bored in the back of a flywheel are to the engine's benifit of balance, not the transmission's.

If Uncle Joe has never seen weights on a torque converter except something predating your car, I'd have to question that he ever got very deep into mechanics, as the 440's changed to the externally balanced cast crank in '72-'73, all Mopar 400's are externally balanced as were all the 360's and the 5.9 Magnum as well, but with less weight. The 400 and the later 440's needed less weight on the converter, than the 360, so be aware of this as well if you get handed a used converter with weights on it.

Don't worry about the nose/pilot of the converter fitting into the inset in the crankshaft. My dad replaced a 383 with a '62 361 from his Newport wagon into his '68 Monaco with no issues. It will be the '61 and back where several issues exist.

If the 440 is in good health and it's what you wan't, it can be done correctly, and the later engines did have hardened valve seats, but the older engines in turn have the advantage of higher compression. The easiest route if the converter and spline issues have you scared, would be any steel crank B or RB that I listed earlier. Your motor mounts should bolt to any standard B or RB. I can't disagree with anything that Commando said, if you use an engine from an RV, van or pickup, you will need to trade out the oil pan and pickup tube. I believe he is also right in suggesting to change the exhaust manifolds. Depending on available bosses for brackets, and your lower radiator outlet, you may want to use your original waterpump housing as well, but seeing your timing marks may come into play. Likely the only thing you will encounter changing from the low deck B to the raised RB is your exhaust manifolds will be slightly higher, not for certain but I'm guessing about 1/2" - 5/8"

I mean no ill will toward anyone here, I just think you need to check some things out, and confirm what's compatible and what's not before you dive in. I suggest checking the date of the 440 confirm one way or the other if it is a cast or a forged steel crank. If it is cast as I suspect, a converter from Precision can likely be your simplest solution. They can likey put the proper weight on a converter made with the '67 and earlier internal spline. Again another option could be to put a '68 or newer front pump/input shaft assembly into your existing '62 727, but you need to check with someone that has a good reputation in building transmissions. This would be my personal choice, as your trans could very likely need some new seals that aren't hard as a rock and ready to give up. Assuming your pump/shaft assembly will exchange and the RV transmission is available with the 440, you could use the RV's converter and the pump assembly. Around here you can get a 727 rebuilt by a reputable shop, with a warranty for about $350-$400.

The purple harmonic balancer / dampner is the older internal balanced forged steel version.
The thick balancer is the later externally balanced cast crank version and the engine attached to it absolutely needs the proper weighted converter or drilled flywheel.

Just so you know, I am familiar with your car, My Dad had a '60 Saratoga RB 383, a '61 Windsor 361/3spd floor shift, and a '62 Newport wagon. The '62 wagon and a '60 Plymouth Sport Suburban, 9 pass wagon / 395 Golden Commando were my baby sitters many long days when I was 4-5 years old, while Dad was clearing trees away from home with his HD20 Allis. I grew up facinated with the dashes in the Chryslers, especially at night with the translucent lights. Coolest dash in any car, truck or spaceship...Period..

The '61 you see in the picture is my New Yorker 2drht I think it has every option except A/C. There is a decent black one on Ebay, from Texas. Another note the '62 trans is one year only, starting in '63 they added Park and also new to '63 were the 6 bolt valve covers. You would likely have to special order your 4 bolt gaskets.

Now you have some homework to do,
Good luck
 

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If Uncle Joe has never seen weights on a torque converter except something predating your car,

 

has2bmopar, I never said anything about predating his car. What I meant was that I have only seen weighted converters on the "three pump" 727's, ie the ones that can be push started.
 
Sorry, no. Cars with A727's as late as '65 could be push started.

If I get the chance later, I'll take some photos of one of these early type transmissions with a weighted converter. It came out of a 413 engined C, that was really smooth.
 
Uncle Joe

Sorry, I don't know how I could have possibly misread your thoughts from your statement. I just figured that you were talking about something older, as I have never encountered weights on a torque converter compatable with an externally balanced engine on any Mopar engine from '62 - '70. Something older than that I would not know if the converters had weights on them or not, as I have never dealt with them, thus my predated conclusion.

One of four things is going on here.

1) You are looking at a small amount of weight intended on balancing the converter itself.

2) Someone put a '71 or newer torque converter made for an externally balanced engine in your '65 Chrysler.... I wanted to say New Yorker, because of your 413 statement, but I won't, as my head is still attached by a small amount at this time.

3) You are here to blow smoke up someones...._____, presenting yourself as all knowing, when in reality no one is, that's why I told him to do his research and find the final answers himself. That's how you learn.

4) Possibly, you are bat **** crazy, as you told him he had to have conversion motor mounts in order to put a big block Chrysler in place of a big block Chrysler.

Evidence #2 is your second statement, where you lead off to bash me like I'm an idiot for stating that the later cast crank engines were externally balanced, and they required weights on the converter, as well as having the larger harmonic balancer. But reality reveals that by the end of '73 all 440's were externally balanced with weights on the converter. Starting in '71... all the 360's, starting in '72 all the 400's, '72-'73 340's, and all the 5.9 Magnums. In your 40 odd years of being a Mopar mechanic, exactly what besides a '65 Chrysler did you work on???

Your statement doesn't seem to track right, as it seems to draw conclusions out of the blue...or maybe it's cuz I'm a moron, but... here's your quote...

"In the 40-odd years that I've been working on Mopars, I've only ever seen a weighted converter used on the early type A727. Although their may be exceptions - and knowing mopar - there will be, that means that the original converter, together with its flexplate, can be used. One thing I have seen is two different boss diameters on the converter, so it is worth checking that this is correct for the hole in the rear of the crank that it fits into."

Externally balanced engines therefore dont cause a problem in this area.

Well Joe, in the 40 odd years that I've been a zoo keeper, I've only ever seen a Grizzly bear eat popcorn and Alpo, used on the dog type K9. Although there may be exceptions - and knowing mother nature - there will be, that means that the original wild Grizzly bear together with its cub, can be housepets. One thing I have seen is two different sets of plumbing on the bear, so it is worth checking that this is correct for the hole in the rear that the crank fits into.

Mentally imbalanced bears therefore don't cause a problem in this area.

My intent was purely humor with this last bit, but I apologize ahead of time if I just come accross as a jack-***. Seriously though, we should only give information to help and not hinder, and if we don't know, the answer is easy... I don't know. You have stated some legitimate facts, but other points you made were absolutely wrong. Here or anywhere else, I try to only give advice that I'm fairly certain of, and if in doubt, I look it up, or direct them to a possibly helpful source, vs telling them they need extensive, impossible to find parts, or tell them to just put it together, it will be fine, when in realty you don't know for sure.

Joe, if we aren't helping this guy out, at least we have been some good entertainment.
 
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I stand by anything that the facts enforce, and Joe did post the first snarky comment, but I certainly don't wish to drive anyone away, by any means.

Like Stan, I do enjoy sarcasm and some mockery, and the rewritten post was made to be humurous, not hurtful, I hope it was taken with its intent in mind.
 
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Back on track --- Yet another option

I'm not fond of the manufacturer, as a bad weld on the hub of one of their converters, destroyed the front pump and sent metal throughout a 727 that I just finished, 7-9 miles... has to be a record.

Anyway, I found this as another option so you can use your original converter, if you put an externally balanced engine in your Chrysler.

B&M #10237 - Externally balanced B & RB - About $80

I still think once you've determined what engine you have, that you should contact Precision, as a new converter may not be as expensive as you may think.

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phew that was alot of reading! thank you all for replying i appriciate it! im going to be pulling engine and trans from the RV. it is pretty apparent that until i get all the information i wont really know whats going on. this is my first real engine swap/ mopar build so i wanna do it right and the first time lol. ill come back with pictures and more information when i get the drive train! thanks again!
 
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