F Kaepernick!

[Carmine]

That would be between you and your employer my say means nothing in that regard and it should not. Just like this guy the thread started with spend no time thinking about his statements preferring to form my own opinion or no opinion at all. We all give opinions here, headers/no headers, wheels/no wheels, bias vs radials, and everyone is free to ignore any opinion just as you can with what's his name.

We are all free to ignore or discuss.

One of the things up for discussion is whether or not he should face discipline from the league. I feel that he should, and that's entirely within the NFL's power to do so WITHOUT hurting the 1st amendment one bit.

Riddle me this... if a player came out and said "I don't like XyZ religion, ethnicity, sexual preference, etc.," on his own time, perhaps in a letter to the editor of a small town newspaper; would there not be a shitstorm of protest against the player and the NFL? So is it free speech you're worried about just free speech you agree with?

 

[70bigblockdodge]

We are all free to ignore or discuss.

One of the things up for discussion is whether or not he should face discipline from the league. I feel that he should, and that's entirely within the NFL's power to do so WITHOUT hurting the 1st amendment one bit.
With the room full of lawyers involved in a player's contract you would think a precedent or code of conduct would be in there ( I would guess there is one)

Riddle me this... if a player came out and said "I don't like XyZ religion, ethnicity, sexual preference, etc.," on his own time, perhaps in a letter to the editor of a small town newspaper; would there not be a shitstorm of protest against the player and the NFL? So is it free speech you're worried about just free speech you agree with?

About the riddle. Player should shut the hell up and take the money, long careers in pro sports like football are few and far between, plenty of time for running your mouth after your 50th concussion in five years ends your career. Players get tricked with questions that lead to saying the wrong/offensive thing all the time by reporters. I find it funny sometimes as they dig a hole showing just how dumb or simple minded they are. Best to remember what your mother told you "If you do not have anything good to say best just to say nothing at all"
As to whether I'm worried about free speech, not until the government gets involved.
As far as agreeing with free speech, I'm a American do I have a choice it is my Constitution.

Look in your quoted text for first two answers lol

 

[1978 NYB]

I seriously doubt he'll be in the NFL next year!

 

[1978 NYB]

These brave Warfighters say F Kaepernick too!

 

[67Monaco]

Sooo some of you were alive when the change happened in the 50's so maybe you can answer this question. Other than "tradition", that's only been around since the 50's, why do we even play the anthem at professional games anyway? They're mostly all Americans playing in American stadiums, we know where we are.. Isn't this sort of propagandistic nationalism the thing we used to criticize the Soviets for?

It's his right to make an *** of himself. Also my right not to buy any of his crap nor the 49er's crap, nor the NFLs merchandise for that matter. Personally I think his reasoning is all wrong and most of what he thinks he's fighting against is made up anyway...

 

[Big_John]

Sooo some of you were alive when the change happened in the 50's so maybe you can answer this question. Other than "tradition", that's only been around since the 50's, why do we even play the anthem at professional games anyway? They're mostly all Americans playing in American stadiums, we know where we are.. Isn't this sort of propagandistic nationalism the thing we used to criticize the Soviets for?

I've grown up listening to the National Anthem at most events and I'm close enough to Canada that I'm used to the Canadian anthem being played at the same venues.

So... I googled it.. and found this. From the archives: History of national anthem in sports

 

[1978 NYB]

I stand for the Canadian National Anthem too. Germany too if I'm in country.

 

[tbm3fan]

If you think you can FORCE someone to stand for the national anthem (which, along with the Pledge, is a relatively recent tradition), you’ve really missed the point.

If you think you’re furthering freedom by forcing a flag salute and silencing protest, you’ve really missed the point. If you think it’s American to force someone to respect what you respect and do the traditions that you do, you’ve really missed the point. If you think that the military is the ultimate American institution to be worshiped, you’ve really missed the point and should read Articles I and II of the Constitution.

It’s a flag. It’s a song. It’s tradition, but by no means is one required to stand, put a hand over the heart, etc. Freedom of speech means participating or not participating. A sheriff threatening to not protect Kaep is literally failing to provide equal protection under the law. A public school teacher punishing a student for not standing is arguably a 1st Amendment violation by the government.

The pomp and circumstance of the anthem are superficial, recently invented, and voluntary. If you want to respect America’s values, let people do what they want. Punishing those who don't harm others and are merely protesting, satirizing, or disrespecting puts you on the spectrum with the Charlie Hebdo attackers in my book

By the way my sister's husband was in the Army for 10 years stationed in Germany. He also happens to be black and has no issue with Kap given his different side of the street view. I have a great niece, who is a nurse, and a great nephew, six years Navy, now studying geology. In my 35 years around them, in liberal Northern California, I have seen all sorts of bias towards them. Some blatant but most very subtle. I hear some tone deaf people around here. In many ways there are two different worlds here and until you can be in both, like me, then you will never know where I come from nor understand what they deal with. I consider my nephew/niece to be half white and half black yet most all whites think they are black and respond to them that way. Talking to my nephew a few weeks ago he tells me his white friends asked him how he felt about Kap and his stance. I wonder why and lucky for them I wasn't around to take them down.

 

[67Monaco]

I've grown up listening to the National Anthem at most events and I'm close enough to Canada that I'm used to the Canadian anthem being played at the same venues.

So... I googled it.. and found this. From the archives: History of national anthem in sports

So it gives the when and the reason. Some band was bored and in typical American fashion it was cemented with a dick measuring contest by both teams not wanting to be out done. Got it. Stupid reason to play it before every game.


BTW, thanks for the link I had not read that before. Actually never really researched it much.


Oh as a PS, from the article; "Every year, the Pentagon approves several hundred requests for military flyovers (even if that means five F-18s buzzing the closed roof of Cowboys Stadium, as was the case at this year's Super Bowl)."

Should have read; "Every year, the Pentagon approves several hundred requests for military flyovers at tax payers expense (even if that means five F-18s buzzing the closed roof of Cowboys Stadium, as was the case at this year's Super Bowl)."

 

[tunaboat75]

I now have two reasons to hate Collin Kaepernick (first one being when he and the 49er's ran all over the Packers defense in the playoffs a few years back when the 49er's went on their Super Bowl run). What gets me is the domino affect his actions have had and will continue to have. Not only on other pro athletes but on younger athletes too. I recently saw on the news that a high school football team refused to stand for the National Anthem! Young athletes look up to the pros and is this really what we want them imitating? I'm sorry but whether they have the right to or not I see it as being very disrespectful. And what happens when the NBA season starts up again? Are we going to see NBA players (most of whom are African American) refusing to stand too? I just don't like the road this seams to be going down.

Kid Rock couldn't have said it any better...

 

[tbm3fan]

So is your issue that they aren't respectful the way you are? Or is it because it gets in the way of your sporting event? Or are you bothered by the fact that it seems to be black players who are being disrespectful as per your standards. With Kaep being half white/half black and being raised by a white adoptive family why does he identify more as black then as white? I know this answer like the back of my hand.

I see a Kroger's store in the midwest has a Sunday NFL gear day during football season. Show your true colors so one 16 year old came in with his #7 jersey. A customer complained about it and the store manager pulled the worker aside telling him to go home and change. The manager didn't tell everyone to go home and change just only that one employee yet the manager requested favorite gear. Does anyone see the problem here? Kroger's HQ has now apologized to the sales associate and paid him for the missed work due to the manager.

Personally I have never liked the idea of the National Anthem before any sporting event precisely because it is just a sporting event and nothing more. This isn't Memorial Day, the christening of a new ship or any other armed forces event. It was a marketing stunt which has continued to be milked, especially so by the NFL, for their own benefit. To me that makes it phony and I don't believe that the National Anthem should ever be used by any corporation of any kind for their benefit. Not to mention all those standing while playing with their cellphones. To me that devalues it's significance hearing it several times a week. The Anthem should have meaning it should have gravitas. Should someone feel that what it stands for has let them down then I want to know how so rather than condemn them for not behaving like me.

As an example how far this can go I'm sure no one knows that before every movie, in the Philippines, they play their National Anthem. The first time for me I had no clue while everyone stood so I stayed seated. My date told me to stand for it and I asked why as it isn't mine. She said if you don't and someone makes a call the Philippines National Police will be waiting outside and will arrest you for being disrespectful. A foreigner never has a good time with the PNP. You have money and they know it. So I stood yet was it my free choice or was I forced?

Last comment concerning gravitas. After spending 3 1/2 months in Europe, in 1976, when I came home the first two things to make a big impression on me was a drinking fountain and the Flag. Seeing it everyday is not the same as seeing it after a long absence. Spending a month in Asia and then flying home right over the Golden Gate Bridge has gravitas because I know I am home versus seeing it everyday and taking it for granted. Hearing the anthem every week doesn't do much for me. Hearing it after several months of not hearing it will be tears to my eyes. Which way has gravitas and which way would I prefer?

 

[tunaboat75]

So is your issue that they aren't respectful the way you are? Or is it because it gets in the way of your sporting event? Or are you bothered by the fact that it seems to be black players who are being disrespectful as per your standards. With Kaep being half white/half black and being raised by a white adoptive family why does he identify more as black then as white? I know this answer like the back of my hand.

I see a Kroger's store in the midwest has a Sunday NFL gear day during football season. Show your true colors so one 16 year old came in with his #7 jersey. A customer complained about it and the store manager pulled the worker aside telling him to go home and change. The manager didn't tell everyone to go home and change just only that one employee yet the manager requested favorite gear. Does anyone see the problem here? Kroger's HQ has now apologized to the sales associate and paid him for the missed work due to the manager.

Personally I have never liked the idea of the National Anthem before any sporting event precisely because it is just a sporting event and nothing more. This isn't Memorial Day, the christening of a new ship or any other armed forces event. It was a marketing stunt which has continued to be milked, especially so by the NFL, for their own benefit. To me that makes it phony and I don't believe that the National Anthem should ever be used by any corporation of any kind for their benefit. Not to mention all those standing while playing with their cellphones. To me that devalues it's significance hearing it several times a week. The Anthem should have meaning it should have gravitas. Should someone feel that what it stands for has let them down then I want to know how so rather than condemn them for not behaving like me.

As an example how far this can go I'm sure no one knows that before every movie, in the Philippines, they play their National Anthem. The first time for me I had no clue while everyone stood so I stayed seated. My date told me to stand for it and I asked why as it isn't mine. She said if you don't and someone makes a call the Philippines National Police will be waiting outside and will arrest you for being disrespectful. A foreigner never has a good time with the PNP. You have money and they know it. So I stood yet was it my free choice or was I forced?

Last comment concerning gravitas. After spending 3 1/2 months in Europe, in 1976, when I came home the first two things to make a big impression on me was a drinking fountain and the Flag. Seeing it everyday is not the same as seeing it after a long absence. Spending a month in Asia and then flying home right over the Golden Gate Bridge has gravitas because I know I am home versus seeing it everyday and taking it for granted. Hearing the anthem every week doesn't do much for me. Hearing it after several months of not hearing it will be tears to my eyes. Which way has gravitas and which way would I prefer?

My issue is that I don't feel they respect the flag/anthem the way it SHOULD be respected because of what it represents. You stand and acknowledge the flag (not by sitting or kneeling) and the country we live in and how lucky & thankful we are to have the freedoms we have. In short, because it's the right thing to do.

 

[Carmine]

I see a Kroger's store in the midwest has a Sunday NFL gear day during football season. Show your true colors so one 16 year old came in with his #7 jersey. A customer complained about it and the store manager pulled the worker aside telling him to go home and change. The manager didn't tell everyone to go home and change just only that one employee yet the manager requested favorite gear. Does anyone see the problem here?

Goodness, this does sound like a terrible injustice. I once saw a guy wear a Corvette T-shirt at a Viper event. They made him stand at the back of a group photo. I always figured it was because of the shirt, but now that I think about it, the Corvette/Viper owner was black. Hmmm (true story BTW).

 

[1978 NYB]

Even his own mother said he is wrong......

Colin Kaepernick's Mom Offers Stinging Take On His Refusal To Stand For National Anthem

 

[65sporty]

My 21 yr old is a huge football fan and he follows things more closely than I do. He questions whether if Colin was starting for the 49nrs that day would he have started his protest? But since he was on the bench good day to start my protest. I wonder....

 

[Fratzog]

Arguably Kapernick's actions lack empathy for those who fought for his right of free expression but it is precisely his right to do so that was being fought for. Also his actions don't go anywhere near civil disobedience but rather are simply a personal expression of frustration. Do I agree with his perspective? Only in part because IMHO the black community needs to look in the mirror. However I recognise there there are a lot of under trained and under paid members of law enforcement south of the border. When I was resurrecting my Polara I had occasion to drive down to mid-Ohio on a parts run. The seller worked for the local Sheriff's department and it became apparent he was selling parts on the side to supplement his income which when he told me what it was floored me. It was about 1/3 of what an entry level cop made at the time in Ontario. I believe the vast majority of cops in the U.S are consummate professionals but many of them are doing a thankless job without the proper resources and training.

 

[1978 NYB]

My 21 yr old is a huge football fan and he follows things more closely than I do. He questions whether if Colin was starting for the 49nrs that day would he have started his protest? But since he was on the bench good day to start my protest. I wonder....

He can protest at the unemployment office next year....

 

[tbm3fan]

My 21 yr old is a huge football fan and he follows things more closely than I do. He questions whether if Colin was starting for the 49nrs that day would he have started his protest? But since he was on the bench good day to start my protest. I wonder....

There is actually more background to this whole story going back about three years leading up to this point. His biological mother and him haven't been on the best of terms after he was given up for adoption. She came out of the woodwork once Kaep appeared on the scene with the 49ers a few years ago. It is spelled opportunist. National press did a typical bad story with nary any background research. Anyway I will not bother to go into it since as has been mentioned he is not respecting the flag as I have determined the flag should be respected and therefore he is not entitled to his own opinion on it. Pretty much cut and dry there.

Nonetheless he did start people talking about it one way or the other across the country. Definitely took some people's comfort zone away from them. Had he simply had an after practice interview he would have been dismissed easily. Still I'm more insulted that Trump would ridicule a handicapped reporter by mocking him. To me PC means plainly civil and obviously someone never ever learned that.

 

[bluefury361]

What do you expect.......? He's a football player.

 

[1978 NYB]

What do you expect.......? He's a football player.

And not a very good one......